We often talk about things being gendered or racialized on this blog, but we haven’t talked much about how race is gendered and gender racialized. In a previous post, I wrote:
According to American cultural stereotypes, black people, both men and women, are more masculine than white people. Black men are seen as, somehow, more masculine than white men: they are, stereotypically, more aggressive, more violent, larger, more sexual, and more athletic. Black women, too, as seen as more masculine than white women: they are louder, bossier, more opinionated and, like men, more sexual and more athletic.
Conversely, Asian people, both men and women, are often stereotyped as more feminine than white people. Asian men are seen as small and less muscular than white men; Asian women are seen as more passive and deferential than white women.
Interracial marriage rates bear out this asymmetry: black women are less likely to marry white men than vice versa and Asian men are less likely to marry white women than vice versa (see here and here).
The idea, specifically, that Asian women are more passive and deferential than white women, has been used to explain white men’s fetish for Asian women, Western men’s sex tourism in Asian countries, and Western men’s use of Asian mail-order bride services. Some of these men, it is argued, want a subordinate partner and they find it difficult to meet a white/American woman who is willing to play that role. You can actually hear a male sex tourist make this argument in this post.
I introduce all of these ideas in order to frame a screenshot sent in by Megan S. The screenshot is of the front page of a website (antimisandry.com) devoted to fighting misandry, or the “hatred of males as a sex.” The website purports to “cur[e] feminist indoctrination.” You’ll see that it is also advertising a dating site specializing in matching up white men with Chinese women:
So… I’m going to guess that, in this case, “anti-misandry” isn’t so much about encouraging women to stop hating men as it is about telling men they are entitled to a woman who will defer to them.
Either that or… unfortunate random ad placement.
Megan also thought this post on men choosing fictional female characters as lovers was related; you might also check out our post on the documentary Guys and Dolls about men who have relationships with expensive and “functional” (if you know what I mean) life-size dolls.
UPDATE: The comments thread on this post is closed. I strongly suggest reading them, especially if you think that this post was reaching. Very interesting.
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Lisa Wade is a professor of sociology at Occidental College. You can follow her on Twitter and Facebook.
Comments 157
ben — July 25, 2009
That looks like a google contextual ad, which means that google scans the pages for what the content is, and places ads that it thinks will appeal to the readers. So, it's placement falls somewhere in between purposeful and random.
Anonymous — July 25, 2009
Yes, it's only relevant to the subject matter if the Google algorithms say it is. Interesting how you came to your conclusions though.
Black, white, Asian, masculine, feminine « The Toothbrush Debates — July 25, 2009
[...] 25, 2009 by eliwrites Lisa at Sociological Images intersects race and gender: According to American cultural stereotypes, black people, both men and women, are more masculine [...]
John — July 25, 2009
Incredible how all those negative characteristics are considered 'masculine', bossy, violent, etc. So much for an unbias attitude.
Anyway, those are google ads. That means they are not programmed like your blogs misleads it's viewers to understand. Nice try, liars. Let me guess, you're pro feminist? That explains the lack of honesty....
Dusk_Blue — July 25, 2009
I think this is a case of uncontrollable ads. The fact that there is a site to "[cure] feminist indoctrination" seems worth examination, though. Why not analyze that part?
Duran — July 25, 2009
>> Asian women are seen as more passive and deferential than white women.
Have you ever BEEN to Japan?
Lance — July 25, 2009
Just to break up the "nyah nyah you're all men-hating liars" series of comments: I'd like to recommend the movie The Civilization of Maxwell Bright, which concerns a misogynistic businessman (Patrick Warburton) who, tired of American women who argue with him, orders an Asian mail-order bride (Marie Matiko). For me, the title evokes the Quantum Leap episode "The Americanization of Machiko" about a sailor who comes home with a Japanese wife--that may just be me, I always loved Quantum Leap--but explicitly turns around the perspective on who has to change. Anyway, I liked it.
Tintin LaChance — July 25, 2009
"Have you ever BEEN to Japan?"
Surprisingly enough, understanding mainstream Western attitudes towards Asia doesn't actually require one to visit Asia.
Three words for you, buddy: Little. China. Girl.
Angela — July 25, 2009
John there are such things as errors. And they noted that it coudl also be accidental. Although google ads has things that try to place ads that will be effective ot the audience.
And feminism makes you lie? Oh I forgot that anti-feminists always tell the truth.
Tara — July 25, 2009
That site is a bit scary, although I did see a quote in one user's signature - something along the lines that it's important not to hate all women (obviously it's OK to hate a few..) otherwise their movement will just turn into feminism (which is clearly chock-full of man-hating women).
Chris W — July 25, 2009
I think that perhaps socioeconomic status gets mixed up with race in all this.
E.g., A sex tourist is almost by definition entering into a situation with someone who is desperate enough for money that they will sell their body or are being forced to do it by organized crime. Someone in that position is going to be pretty passive and deferential just like the sex tourist is likely to be a sad loser seeking out someone with those qualities.
I've known a lot of real asian women - american born, foreign born, poor, rich, etc... There is as wide a range of passivity to dominance as you would see with other races.
AR — July 25, 2009
Your description of racial stereotypes as they apply to the different sexes seems to me to show sexual and racial prejudice as behaving as you would expect completely independent variables to behave, as the stereotype you say are applied to black women is just those applied to blacks plus those applied to women, as opposed to any interesting non-linear interaction.
Sunday Catch Up « The Gender Blender Blog — July 26, 2009
[...] Marketing Asian Women to Anti-feminist Men. [...]
jem — July 26, 2009
Your mention of the Documentary about the guys who have very lifelike(ish) sex dolls (which I have seen by the way) reminds me of this article that I saw someplace on a blog about this guy that invented a robot woman, It was just about as disturbing as the documentary(sadly this guy reminds me of a guy I almost dated, dodge a f*cking bullet). Here are a couple links about this guy and his "fembot"-
http://www.asylum.com/2008/12/10/man-invents-robot-girlfriend-changes-world/
http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/article2023392.ece
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=91625470
jem — July 26, 2009
do these comments get approved before they show up on the page?
md — July 26, 2009
Yes, as many of you have pointed out, that ad is there by "accident" and in fact I just visited the site and had an ad for Lava Life (a dating site) and the photo in the ad was of a (blonde) white woman.
But... the mistake about the "racialness" of the ad aside, this "Anti-misandry site" is interesting and worth discussing. Top of their list of so-called examples discrimination against men is a category called "health". I believe Soc Images had a recent post questioning why there are so many products aligning themselves with breast cancer awareness but not so many aligning themselves with men's illnesses, such as prostate cancer.
This "anti-misandry" site also questions why men smoke more, drink more, and end up in emergency rooms more often. I'm not sure if they can blame feminists for that, though!!
I really question their other claim that women are more likely to commit domestic violence against their partners or children. (The link to this "serious study" is for another "anti misandry" website .. not exactly a neutral source).
Feckless — July 26, 2009
@Tara, you were talking about that signature:
"The men's and fathers' movement needs to make sure it never sees females as the enemy,
but only misandry--whether from females or from males.
If not, we'll become like the bigoted feminists that this movement was formed to oppose.
Glenn Sacks"
Tara — July 26, 2009
@Feckless
Thanks, yeah I couldn't find it when I went back in. My problem with the quote is that it isn't clear whether all feminists are considered "bigoted feminists", otherwise I would actually agree with it.
Some of the posts on the website, however, are really misogynistic, including a thread called "Explaining male superiority" and advice on "Don't marry Career Women". . Um..are they so unaware that they don't comprehend how hypocritical that is?? I'm surprised their brains aren't exploding from the cognitive dissonance.
Anon — July 26, 2009
2 threads from that forum concerning the themes touched on in this post.
From "Western Women's Lack of Natural Femininity": "This is like the uglification of the west. Meanwhile in Asia the women are much more natural feminine and pleasant to be with."
http://antimisandry.com/chit-chat-main/western-womens-lack-natural-femininity-21623.html
From "Are feminists more afraid of black men than white men?": "From what I've seen and heard feminist tend to target mostly white men. A few have targeted black men and got trumped!"
http://antimisandry.com/chit-chat-main/feminists-more-afraid-black-men-than-white-men-21606.html
Tiara — July 26, 2009
Never mind Japan or China - anyone who thinks Asian women are subservient obviously hasn't seen the females in my Bangladeshi family tree ;)
Kris — July 26, 2009
@John: "Incredible how all those negative characteristics are considered ‘masculine’, bossy, violent, etc. So much for an unbias attitude."
So you disagree that men (keep in mind that this is STEREOTYPICALLY) are portrayed as the more aggressive, sexual, large, and athletic of the two genders? Please, let me know where you get your news, entertainment, etc. I'd love to see both genders portrayed as androgynous.
Karla — July 26, 2009
For all the fire and vitrol in this conversation, I'm surprised the language barrier hasn't come up.
Think about it -- an assertive, confident, intelligent person will likely be less engaged when immersed in a totally different culture and language.
On a personal note, I speak fairly good French... however, if in an all-French environment, I am more reserved and less outgoing or opinionated, due to not being fully certain I'm understanding the situation, or even expressing myself adequately. This may look like passivity, but is in fact the act of being withdrawn due to language and cultural barriers.
Who says Asian women arent the same way? This perception of their passivity may just be the manifestation (and fetish-ization) of said language-induced social withdrawal.
In their own spaces, the Asian ladies I know are forces to be reckoned with!
Tara — July 26, 2009
Karla, there are huge issues with sexism in Japan, apparent even at the very high highest level of their society. The current Imperial Household Law does not allow women to succeed to the throne. This position may be more symbolic than anything else but it is a very visible symptom of deeper issues within society.
And look at articles like this published called "Women, know your place"...!!
http://search.japantimes.co.jp/cgi-bin/fl20090331zg.html (I'm aware this is an English-language paper)
There was talk of introducing a law in 2004 to help more equality in the workplace as it is notorious for Japanese women to reach positions of high authority - the glass ceiling as alive and well.
I'm not an expert so please correct me if this is wrong! :)
Brown Shirt — July 26, 2009
GOOGLE! MARKETS ASIAN WOMEN TO ANTI-FEMINIST MEN
Note the self-imposed psychological anguish and typical lather that reactionary feminists get themselves into when attempting to reckon with the obvious superiority possessed by their foreign born Asian "sisters." Well, in this case Google made them do it!
http://www.online-dating-rights.com/forum/index.php?topic=1698.0
.
Delphi_Pro — July 26, 2009
People are getting way to psychoanalytical here. Regardless of whatever stereotypes people imagine or believe, they have a right to meet people from wherever they choose through travel, dating services, personal ads or whatever form of introduction they choose. Two consenting, marriage eligible adults have a right to be together if they choose. Their reasons for wanting to be together are none of anybody's business.
American men having a "fetish" for Asian women does not make it "sex trafficking", "sex tourism", "bride purchasing" or "mail order bride" marriage. These terms are hyperbolic figures of speech intended to arouse hysteria, and the use of this language needs to stop.
Men have all kinds of "fetishes"... some men like blonds, brunettes, tall women, short women... and yes, some have "ethic" preferences. Funny how if the "fetish" is for "Asian" women, all of a sudden it becomes something dark and sinister.
These people need to get a life.
Delphi_Pro — July 26, 2009
I want to add that people "market" women to men all the time. They "market" them on billboard signs selling cigarettes and booze, magazine and TV ads selling everything from cars to shaving cream and cologne, and even companies "market" their services using sexy young women at front desks to attract the male (often much older!) clients. Men are constantly being "sold" the image of pretty, sexy young women throughout our mainstream media and culture, yet no one seems to object and call it "exploitative".
However, let someone point out in a dating ad or personal introduction service that women from certain areas TEND to exhibit certain traits ON AVERAGE, then everyone screams "exploitation" and "trafficking". All of a sudden women are being "sold" to men as "products". It's a witch hunt!
SarahMC — July 26, 2009
Funny how y'all believe "Asian women" (broad category there don't you think?') MUST be flattered to be fetishized by entitled white boy-children, and that none of us who criticize your sexism-racism are Asian ourselves (I'm guessing you mean East-Asian).
tigtog — July 26, 2009
@Delphi_Pro
Right there, you show that you know nothing about feminism.
Feminism has been decrying the commercialisation of the beauty myth via idealised images of women in advertising as exploitation (ever heard the term "sexual objectification"?) for many decades now.
Earl — July 27, 2009
While feminists continue to babble and complain about white men I continue enjoying a 10 year marriage with my Asian "fetish". It is something about the female part of her that turns me on I guess.
If forced to spend my remaining days with a modern day feminist, or making love to a man..... wait those are the same things, sorry!
Tara — July 27, 2009
Earl, *yawn* - comparing feminists to men? So old...Must try harder.
Brownshirt - "obvious superiority"? Sounds suspiciously like the rhetoric from antimisandry.com..hmm..
Frank Johnson — July 27, 2009
Feminists hate foreign women almost as much as they hate men. They know foreign women are superior to them and this is why they endorse sneaked in "laws" like IMBRA, which is designed to stop foreign women, aka competition, from marrying American men and disrupting all their many years of feminist fascism. Nothing makes a feminist more angry than to see a man happy.
Tristan Laurent — July 27, 2009
The author of this blog post states: "The idea, specifically, that Asian women are more passive and deferential than white women, has been used to explain white men’s fetish for Asian women, Western men’s sex tourism in Asian countries, and Western men’s use of Asian mail-order bride services. Some of these men, it is argued, want a subordinate partner and they find it difficult to meet a white/American woman who is willing to play that role."
Since the author of this post seems to know what these American men want, what is it that American women want? More to the point, why is it that there are hundreds and hundreds of blog posts, ersatz research studies and reports by feminist-activists examining (and condemning) the fact that American men are eager to marry foreign women and that foreign women are eager to marry American men, but never bothering to ask why the converse is not true.
So I will ask it. Why is it that while American women are very heavily involved in internet dating they only confine the objects of their desires other Americans? Why are there tens of thousands of foreign women eager to meet American men but no or virtually no foreign men eager to meet American women? Why are there dating sites devoted to matching foreign women and American men but no sites devoted to matching American women and foreign men? We live in a very capitalistic world, and if this market existed someone would exploit it.
Are American women inherently racist? Are American women such bad partners that no men in the world want to be with them? For all the complaining that American women feminists do about American men, could it be that the men aren't really so bad and that all the foreign men are much worse?
This to me is a fascinating question, but one I fear cannot be discussed in polite society, including on blog posts, because of the potential negative implications the answers carry for American women and for the American brand of feminism. But it is a question that begs for a serious answer.
Jenna — July 27, 2009
Tristan: the converse is not true because America, like most countries, still believes in and disseminates the stereotype that the male should be the breadwinner in a MF relationship. Therefore, it is acceptable for females from a less affluant country to marry males here, who would have a higher wage. In addition, it is this access to comparable economic well-being that leads them to do so. The converse is not true with females of a higher economic status than males (with a very few exceptions on both sides, of course).
Also, countries that tend to have a lower economic status than the US also tend to have larger discrepencies in gender roles, rendering the men in those countries more likely to be boorish jerks of a degree that even we don't display. Why would we WANT to import those? The men over here are bad enough.
jeana — July 27, 2009
It isn't just Asian women that are perceived to be good wives for men. It's any non-American woman (with exceptions for certain countries like Norway, in which woman apparently have more rights than usual).
Men's Rights Activists (at least at glennsacks.com) bemoan the horrible lot of American women that is available to them and promote going overseas to find the little missus. They love how subservient those women are and how very lucky they feel to be allowed any freedoms by their American husbands. They boast about how foreign women believe that American women are selfish and don't know our rightful place. And they also lament that after a few years, many of these women get "tainted" by evil feminists and start becoming selfish (wanting to do things without their husband's approval, I'm guessing).
It's nothing more complicated than a hatred of all things female. Spend a little time at a MRA blog or website and see for yourself.
jeana — July 27, 2009
Tristan, I’d guess that the main driving force for foreign women to marry American men has mainly to do with CITIZENSHIP. Wouldn’t you like to be in a country in which you have more freedom and more rights? Do you see English or French females desperate to marry American men? Or are they from Eastern Europe, South America, etc.? Countries where they have little hope for decent future prospects.
And you snidely wonder if American women are racist because we’re not trying to find mates overseas. “Are American women such bad partners that no men in the world want to be with them?” No, we’re just not so desperate that we need to leave the country because no one here wants us. And “desperate” is the correct word. How come you never hear about mail-order husbands?
jeana — July 27, 2009
Frank,
“Nothing makes a feminist more angry than to see a man happy.” It’s comments like this that betray the ignorance of women-hating MRAs.
Delphi_Programmer — July 27, 2009
Jeana,
You never fully answered Tristan's question, "Why are foreign men not coming over here to marry American women?" However, you did give a hint ("why would we WANT to import that when men here are bad enough?"). Could it be the reason is that American women belittle foreign men, look down on them, and see them as less than themselves? Could you be the ones who are racist, and not us? After all, if these countries are so bad, then U.S. citizenship benefits men as much as women. The same motive, it seems, would exist on both sides.
I also challenge your assertion that foreign women see CITIZENSHIP as the goal (which you put in all caps, for some reason). There are many American men living in the Philippines with the women whom they married through friendship columns. Many of these couples spend their retirement years there. What is the use of U.S. citizenship if you end up living in your own country anyway?
Delphi_Programmer — July 27, 2009
Also think about this. If dating, romance and marriage through international channels isn't a natural pattern, then how do you explain the Latin American, Russian and East Asian women who met and married their American and western husbands through the Sheela Wood column, Match, Christian Singles International, Cupid's Destiny and dozens of other "ethnic neutral" venues? How do you explain the ones who place ads and meet through local personals columns? Or those who meet through personal blog sites or even by word of mouth? None of these services "present" women to men in any way. In fact, most are just public bulletin boards where people meet and find friendship or romance.
If people from certain countries want to meet people from other countries they will if they have to float messages in bottles across the ocean!
To say that a business venue is "exploiting" women because they introduce them to the kind of men you don't approve of is patronizing and wrong. People should be free to seek companionship with whomever they choose.
jeana — July 27, 2009
Delphi,
First of all, I didn’t say “why would we WANT to import that when men here are bad enough?”. That was Jenna; slightly different from “Jeana”. Secondly, all caps because I was shouting. Then I had some coffee and calmed down.
I don’t agree that American women belittle foreign men. I thought it was the opposite; they are seen as more exciting. Although this seems to apply only to certain nationalities. I don’t see how you can find it racist that American women don’t look overseas for mates. In order to call American women racist, you’d have to show how they only wanted to date within their race, which isn’t true for everyone. The best you can do is to call them nationalistic (and I thought we’re supposed to “buy American”).
Plus, I don’t mean to characterize all American/foreign relationships as desperate men/visa-seeking women. The question isn’t “why aren’t foreign men coming here to marry American women” (ignoring the fact that many do marry American women for citizenship rights also), the question is “why do men seek out foreign brides.” At least, that’s my question. And I think the answer does have a lot to do with expecting less empowered females.
jeana — July 27, 2009
Delphi,
Also, I’m not saying those venues you mention exploit women necessarily, but men still go there seeking foreign-born women, don’t they? Obviously, some of the time it’s just people meeting people, but some of the time it’s also men looking for a certain type of woman. Foreign-born. No feminist types need apply. I don’t think men finding foreign-born women is quite as serendipitous as you suggest.
Sami — July 27, 2009
@Tara: I think the difference is this: that the presence of sexism or the glass ceiling in Japan does not mean or imply that Japanese women are submissive.
I think Western people often read Japanese folks' (men AND women) reservedness as passivity. It's a nearsighted assumption, because there are many other social values at work (teamwork, pride, and on) that are misread as shyness or awkwardness. Strength does not always have to be loud. The funny thing is, when this assumption is made about Japanese men, it's desexualizing - think of the 'Asian geek' stereotype in 80s movies - but made about Japanese women, it's eroticizing. And I think that's the train that Lisa, the OP, rode in on.
Ashley — July 27, 2009
Oh my, these comments are hilarious.
"Hey, feminists are all man haters. I like female women and not MAN women!!!"
"YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND FEMINISM!!!"
Repeat ad nauseum.
Jenna — July 27, 2009
Delphi_Programmer: actually, I did, with the whole paragraph previous to that one sentence, which you apparently somehow managed to NOT read.
Simple answer: economics and the politics of economics.
And I do find it hilarious that you managed to be so blind to women as individuals that you conflated two entirely different commentators.
Forestroad — July 27, 2009
Perhaps why Kate of Jon and Kate plus 8 has gotten the reputation in pop culture of being manly and domineering--she is married to an Asian man, after all, so it must make sense.
Elena — July 27, 2009
Actually, the stereotype of submissive Japanese women couldn't be more wrong. The normal order of domestic economy is that husbands hand their wives their whole salary, and then the wives give back some pin money for small manly purchases like cigars or drinks. Recently middle-aged women have been divorcing their husbands in droves because after they retire from work, they realise that they're complete strangers to one another.
So good luck with your very own yamato nadeshiko, guys.
Stacey — July 27, 2009
Aside from the amusingly unfortunate ad placement, I think my favorite part is the site's unflinching assertion that feminism and misandry are the same thing.
Funny... I was pretty sure I liked men just fine...
SarahMC — July 27, 2009
"Why are foreign men not coming over here to marry American women?"
Try using your superior male mind to think critically about this. I'll give you a hint: economics. The only reason women from impoverished, highly patriarchal countries "want" you, an American man, is because they would like some food in their bellies.
Matt K — July 27, 2009
Can we maybe not bother engaging with MRAs jumping over whenever lisa or gwen posts something related to masculinity? A nice whack of the old banhammer would be nicer, but still.
And this is coming from a guy who has, in the past, had the whole "maybe people could get it if it were explained to them calmly" mentality re: feminism. I don't think a lot of the commenters we're seeing now even WANT to get it. I admire everyone here who's fighting the good fight but I can't help but think we're just playing by their rules if we let obvious trolls run rampant.
Trish — July 27, 2009
Tristan: According to a recent article in the New York Times about men who have "relationships" with pillows printed with the images of 10 year old anime characters instead of real women, a quarter of Japanese men between the ages of 30 and 34 are virgins because they are so intimidated by "submissive" Asian women.
I'm boggled that so many men, American and otherwise, are such fearful creatures that they are unable to relate to women as equals and friends.
Anon2 — July 27, 2009
@Trish
Though the pillow phenomenon also affects women too, not only men. It's more about secluded and timid people whom are afraid or too shy of engaging into a relationship with , usually, the opposite sex.
Tara — July 28, 2009
@Elena, what about power outside the private sphere? I don't consider having all the power in the home as anything approaching near equality - rather its a very strong indicator that the gender divide is alive and well. Thanks for proving our points!
@Sami, yes I see what you mean. Although equality is something that has to be taken as well as given. I suppose sexism doesn't necessarily mean passivity in women and as we all know, there can be many women that actively work to keep the status quo of a patriarchy. Then again, with such huge issues like female foeticide in countries like China and India, I would seriously worry about the impact that those societies' attitudes have on the mental state of women...no? :)
Anon — July 28, 2009
I am an Arab female. Many young men in my country spend their whole nights at internet cafes finding older western women and seducing them for marriage or at least some money. The pattern is much the same as with the western men seeking eastern/south american brides. Younger person seeks older person for money and citizenship. Their behavior may REALLY change once they get what they want.
So it's just not true that only foreign women seek to improve their conditions by marrying western men.
Anon — July 28, 2009
Another thing: It's not true either that American women are racists who look down on foreign men. Many western women come to our countries and hook up with local men, besides the ones who meet online. I don't feel that western women belittle our men any more than western men belittle our women. Western women frequently make comments that our men are exotic, handsome, charming, "real men," and family-oriented. It's not rare to hear them putting down western men in comparison to the local men.
Actually, sometimes I think western women put up with things from our men that they wouldn't put up with from a western man.
Brown Shirt — July 28, 2009
Yes, a very very small cache of older Western women do actively seek out foreign men for hookups and especially on sex tours to Jamaica and some other developing nations. Unlike Western men seeking younger foreign women, these older Western women are typically not in it for family formation. More importantly, there exists no endless shrieking blogs denigrating American women for seeking any man they choose. In other words, this fleeting trend has no perceived negative impact for American men. But it is a subject of parody.
American men get a dual benefit. They get to choose from a VAST bevy of young already happy foreign women (and visit them in amazing tropical places) AND get the added perk of really infuriating American feminists. It just works on so many levels.
.
jeana — July 28, 2009
Brown Shirt,
I'm not sure men going overseas infuriates feminists. I know you think it does, because you are under the impression that we want all American men to only marry American women (to give us a better chance since we're all ugly and fat, right?). I think one thing feminists object to is the exploitation of these females.
I didn’t know that men find these females in exotic tropical places. Lots come from Eastern Europe and other places that might be considered to be pretty, but are poverty stricken. Yes, you go and find a very poor female with no hopes and no prospects and use her for sex and exploit her as a submissive wife. Real men don’t have to resort to desperate mail-order brides. Nor do they have to pay cash for them. I both laugh at and pity people like you.
Delphi_Programmer — July 28, 2009
Quote: "Try using your superior male mind to think critically about this. I’ll give you a hint: economics. The only reason women from impoverished, highly patriarchal countries “want” you, an American man, is because they would like some food in their bellies."
This is the kind of narrow-minded bigoted remark that gives feminism a bad name. Do you really think about what you say before you say it? How many "American men/foreign-born" couples do you know personally? Before you judge us all, you should take the time to get to know some.
And yes, to address an earlier poster who finds it hilarious that I "don't see women as individuals" because I mixed up a name. The names differed by one letter... "Jenna" vs. "Jeana". I think a minor snafu like that can be overlooked don't you? Unless, of course, you're knit-picking, which feminists are also quite good at.
I maintain that people should be free to seek companionship where and however they choose. You have NO EVIDENCE that anyone is harming anyone. If we can open our arms to gays, lesbians, transvestites, couples who shack up and have babies out of wedlock, women who kill their unborn babies, etc. (I think you get the idea), then I think we should give people (men OR women) the liberty to look for love wherever they desire, next door or across the ocean. Their reasons for doing so are their own business.
We don't live in a nanny state yet. Men's rights activists are the ones who are trying to STOP that from happening.
Delphi_Programmer — July 28, 2009
By the way, I never said that *I think* American women, on the whole, are racists. I merely asked the question to provide food for thought, to get YOU to reflect on why YOU wouldn't marry a foreign man.
I do think that many American women who call themselves "feminists" are reverse sexists. You seem to want a different set of rules for women than for men. You want the freedom to live your life your way, regardless of historic moral codes and ethics. However, when you find something personally objectionable, like international dating (a.k.a. "mail order brides"), then you stand on a soap box and preach to everybody.
Which is it? Do we live in a modern "liberated" world where we embrace and accept everything? Or do we impose some kind of nanny "moral code" on everybody? The "people who live in glass houses" parable comes to mind.
Brown Shirt — July 28, 2009
Quote from Jeana:
"I’m not sure men going overseas infuriates feminists. I know you think it does, because you are under the impression that we want all American men to only marry American women (to give us a better chance since we’re all ugly and fat, right?). I think one thing feminists object to is the exploitation of these females.
I didn’t know that men find these females in exotic tropical places. Lots come from Eastern Europe and other places that might be considered to be pretty, but are poverty stricken. Yes, you go and find a very poor female with no hopes and no prospects and use her for sex and exploit her as a submissive wife. Real men don’t have to resort to desperate mail-order brides. Nor do they have to pay cash for them. I both laugh at and pity people like you."
Oh it certainly does infuriate feminists and it has NOTHING to do with marriage. It has to do with the proactive undermining of feminist ideals. All those international dating sites INCLUDING MATCH.COM INTERNATIONAL, are not used by men to avoid marriage to feminists. No, they are there to meet the HUGE demand for living a life free from the influence of FEMINISM. They work and they have been working for many years. International dating for purposes of snubbing feminism is BIG business because there is BIG demand.
You cannot provide evidence that men are exploiting poor women in foreign countries AFTER first meeting them on an international dating site (unless you are referring to the Jana Claudia Menendez Match.com murder case). You cannot. You cannot. Until you do, be ethical by not spreading hateful lies. You are a liar. Where is the evidence the men are paying cash for women they meet on dating sites? Where o where? Real men do not have to resort to anything; they have options and freely use the government sanctioned pass to paradise: the US Passport. Knowing that must really suck for you. Feminism is dead and we are dancing in the streets - of San Paulo, of Bogota, of Manila, of Lima, of San Pedro, of Shanghai....Yep, American feminism comes to a screeching halt at the Rio Grande River. And there is not a f____ thing you can do about it.
jeana — July 28, 2009
Brown Shirt,
So here’s a question. If “feminism is dead”, then how come you say, “International dating for purposes of snubbing feminism is BIG business because there is BIG demand”? Either feminism is dead or it’s thriving. Which is it?
Plus, why do you men have to go to other countries to find a date? I mean, there are 150 million women in America. Even not counting the children and teens (because no, you can’t date children and teens here [but can in other countries—is that why you go there?]), there are millions of American females. And all are “tainted” by feminism? (Again, I thought feminism was dead.)
And by “feminism”, I’m assuming you mean a female who has a mind of her own, is able to be self-sufficient and not financially depend upon a male, and is not willing to be abused by men. So yes, if this is your definition of feminism, I can see why you need to go to under-developed or repressive, poverty-stricken countries to find females whose choice is living on the streets, selling themselves for cash, or marrying an American who might give them a little better life (or so they hope).
There are plenty of females who don’t consider themselves feminists. In fact, most females say they’re not feminists. And you can’t find one of them?
So yes, go down to the Rio Grande and dance in the street. Find yourself a 14 year old and force yourself on her. Have a great time.
jeana — July 28, 2009
Delphi,
I would marry an international man, but when there are so many wonderful guys in this country, why bother? I guess if no one wanted me here, I’d have no choice but to look elsewhere.
And don’t forget to “open your arms” to all the men who cause and force abortions, ok? Because without your irresponsible behavior and intense pressure on girlfriends and sex partners, the abortion rate would be extremely low, wouldn’t it?
Matt K — July 28, 2009
"I do think that many American women who call themselves 'feminists' are reverse sexists."
Sociology fail.
jeana — July 28, 2009
Matt K.
What does "sociology fail" mean?
Anonymous — July 28, 2009
@Jeana
Sociology :
the study of the development, structure, and functioning of human society.
What Matt would mean is that these men (or women for all we know) don't know what feminism really is about and what a feminist does in society. So they just outright spout bullshit about it trying to make themselves sound (un)convincing.
Matt K — July 28, 2009
Bingo, Anon. Sorry for my confusing wording.
Basically, I think there is no point in arguing with people who believe that feminists are "reverse sexists" given that according to fairly basic sociological ideas (which the readers of this blog are assumed to be familiar with), isms require the backing of power structures. Thus, the concept of sexism against men (or racism against whites, or "heterophobia") just doesn't make sense.
jeana — July 28, 2009
Thank you, Anon and Matt. I should read more of this blog. I got here from a link from feministing.com. I'm really not a man-hater (impossible for MRAs to understand). Having spent over a year on an MRA blog, whenever I encounter an MRA, they turn me into She-Hulk. Must...resist...urge....to...attack...
Anon — July 28, 2009
A lot of the western women that come to our countries for Arab men came there just to tour and were seduced while there. Others came specifically for their partners who they met online. They met them "coincidentally" on tagged or myspace etc. but don't realize that our men were actively seeking them out and it was no coincidence. I don't know what percentage of western women come on tours specifically for sex.
Many of these women will marry their Arab boyfriends and take them to America and possibly get a nasty surprise when attitudes change. Most are coming off bad marriages to western men. They declare western men to be losers and unmanly and announce that Arab men are superior in every way, even in religion sometimes. They are oblivious that many are just wanted for material purposes. Same mentality of western men seeking Asian/South American brides. Everything the western men say, we hear it all the time from western women.
There are plenty of western men (and women!) who are intensely threatened by western women who get involved with Arabs. It takes the form of anti-Islamic screeds and paranoid rants about a Muslim takeover of the west and conquering of Christian wombs. It is all over the web.
The mentality of "the locals are jerks and I'm screwing them by marrying an idealized foreigner" is the same. But when westerners trash western women for marrying Arabs, they are xenophobic, bigoted, and come across far more threatened by it than the western women who mock western men as losers who can't get anyone to date them in their own countries.
Elena — July 28, 2009
@Tara, evidently Japanese society is far from gender equality. It's just that gender inequality manifests in ways wildly different from the usual submissive doormat Asian fetish -- see the "Kyouiku Mama"/ "Education Mama" stereotype of wives neglecting the husband for their son so he gets good grades (and pity the kid who just isn't good at studying), or the eventual absence of sex in marriage when both parties regard themselves more as parents than as a married couple.
So yeah, Japan is a quite dysfunctional society too, only in different ways to Western societies.
Anon — July 28, 2009
A quick selection of "They are taking over white wombs!!" rants:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1921346/posts?q=1&;page=1
http://thesecretskill.com/2077/ticket-to-ride-gullible-american-chicks-are-islams-most-wanted/
http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/2004/05/advice-to-non-muslim-women-against-marrying
http://www.jihadwatch.org/dhimmiwatch/archives/021527.php
http://vikingkitties.blogspot.com/2007/11/why-christian-women-marry-muslim-men.html
Delphi_Programmer — July 28, 2009
Examples of feminism as reverse sexism:
Quote: "Try using your superior male mind to think critically about this. I’ll give you a hint: economics. The only reason women from impoverished, highly patriarchal countries “want” you, an American man, is because they would like some food in their bellies."
Quote: "I’m boggled that so many men, American and otherwise, are such fearful creatures that they are unable to relate to women as equals and friends."
Quote: "Yes, you go and find a very poor female with no hopes and no prospects and use her for sex and exploit her as a submissive wife. Real men don’t have to resort to desperate mail-order brides. Nor do they have to pay cash for them. I both laugh at and pity people like you."
Do you see the hate in these remarks? Do you see a whole lot of compassion here? I sure don't! This, to me, is reverse sexism. I don't care about your sociological babble. These remarks are bigoted, ignorant attacks on innocent people. There is no evidence to back up any of this venom.
I don't go around talking about what "real women" should do or be like or act like. I don't denigrate these women the way they do us.
Matt K — July 28, 2009
From the About section of this blog:
"We assume that you, our audience, are sociologically-inclined folks. So we do not typically include a lengthy sociological interpretation of the images."
So when you say:
"This, to me, is reverse sexism. I don’t care about your sociological babble."
Then kindly GTFO. It's in the frakking name of the blog, so if you aren't interested in playing ball, it doesn't make you a martyr or a freethinker, it makes you a troll. Take it elsewhere.
jeana — July 28, 2009
Anon,
Marrying someone from a foreign country because you love them is one thing. Going out of your way to find a woman (and a submissive, non-feminist, non-threatening woman at that) in a country where you know they are grateful for whatever life you could provide them is something else. And yes, I personally think they cannot get anyone here; at least, not anyone who fits their 1950s version of what a woman/wife should be like. It doesn’t make them a loser, but it does make a statement about the kind of person they are (i.e., the belief that all American women are “tainted” by feminism). I hardly see how criticizing someone who I see as taking advantage of desperate women makes me seem threatened or bigoted.
Plus, if you are into Asian girls, by all means request Asian girls on Match.com or wherever you go. There are plenty in this country. I just can’t help but wonder why certain people must go out of the country to find a mate. And it’s always those men who have a profound disrespect for females.
Anon — July 28, 2009
Jeana, I meant that western women hooking up with Arab men from my countries ARE trashed by western men (and women too, but mostly men), contrary to what Brown Shirt said. It's just that the trashing doesn't take the form of bashing feminism, it takes the form of bigoted anti-Islamic paranoia that Muslims are waging a jihad on Christian vaginas (that these western men imagine they are entitled to). I posted a small example of threads online with wild rants about jihad and the death of the west.
Those men who trash western women with Arab men come across as VERY xenophobic and threatened. They imagine their whole civilization is on the line. And I mean that they sound a lot more threatened than western women who mock the Asian-chasing western men as losers looking for a fantasy submissive wife.
I've met American men who hated American women and idealized foreign women, and I agree that they had twisted ideas about women and people of color in general. Seeing firsthand their hysterical reactions to white women-Arab men, I believe these men are projecting their hatred and inadequacy on others.
Tara — July 28, 2009
@ Elena, thanks for the reply and the info :) very interesting.
jeana — July 28, 2009
Anon, I understand now what you mean. It is like white Americans (male and female) not liking white American females married to non-white (especially black) men. Only with an anti-Islamic flavor.
Those websites are kind of scary. And it is interesting how it is assumed that if you are Muslim you must be a terrorist and you are using an American female for a green card so that you can carry out devious plots.
“jihad on Christian vaginas” (I wonder if it would be ok for those of us who are white, but not Christian?)
Delphi_Pro — July 28, 2009
Quote: "Then kindly GTFO. It’s in the frakking name of the blog, so if you aren’t interested in playing ball, it doesn’t make you a martyr or a freethinker, it makes you a troll. Take it elsewhere."
Go on, threaten me!
You people are a bunch of college educated punks! You sarcastically demean and degrade people, call names and act like kids with the sixth grade 12-year old maturity level that you have!
Anonymous — July 28, 2009
"Go on, threaten me!
You people are a bunch of college educated punks! You sarcastically demean and degrade people, call names and act like kids with the sixth grade 12-year old maturity level that you have!"
I've seen better insults (I love the hypocrisy you've just started right now), then again Matt you also could have used better words instead of feeding the fire.
If you dislike feminists so much, you might as well go back to your forum and go back doing your feminist hating/blaming. (I find that many of the discussions are inherently misogynistic and heavily right winged in general, "oh noes gays are a product of feminism").
Feminist and the MRA will never agree on anything. There's no point in arguing anymore. It's only going to be an endless loop of arguments. Then again I am enjoying the idiotic nonsense from both sides here.
Do everybody on the internet a favour : DO MORE RESEARCH ON FEMINISM. LOOKING IT UP ON MRA SITES DOES NOT COUNT.
ALSO DO MORE RESEARCH ON FOREIGN BRIDES/HUSBANDS, SEX TOURISM AND SEX TRAFFICKING. MANY OF THE COMMENTS HERE IS MOSTLY GENERALIZATIONS ON BOTH SIDES, AT LEAST CITE THE LEGIT SOURCE OF WHERE YOU HAVE FOUND THE INFORMATION.
THE MAGIC OF THE INTERNET IS RIGHT IN FRONT OF YOU.
skeptical_guy — July 28, 2009
lol.....it's no one's business why any man from any country wants to go to another country to find a wife. Obviously they do it for whatever personal reasons they want.
I love Japan. I love and only date Japanese women now after falling in love with my girlfriends I had while there. When I go back next year I plan to find my wife there because I have honestly never found Western women desirable at all.
Why you have so much free time to talk about this shows that some of you should invest in a hobby of some sort.
Anonymous — July 29, 2009
Oh I forgot to add
There ARE women who also goes to asia to seek for a boyfriend (like skeptical_guy there), it 'seems' rare but it's really because these women don't speak up as loudly or explicit (sexually) as some men do. I've met way too many wapanese guys and gals who honest to god only want to date Japanese people or at least someone Asian due to their obsession over Japan (not a bad thing, but most of the time it's because of the jpop and the animu).
Brown Shirt — July 29, 2009
Motivation to date foreign women:
http://www.fox.com/moretolove/
Anonymous — July 29, 2009
Brown Shirt
Wouldn't that be a good reason for women to date foreign men as well?
whoknowswhy — July 29, 2009
bingo skeptical_guy. asian women are simply the best... on many levels (beauty, appearance, culture, attitude, style... just to name a few)
i was born in europe, but grew up in the states. after having lived in east asia for almost a year, i came to the conclusion that i guess i was just never really attracted to white american girls. it happens to a lot of people that spend time abroad in many different places; asia just seemed to be my point of realization.
i was just in europe recently as well... the women are not quite up to par with asian women IMO but leaps and bounds above the idea of the normal white american woman. they are cultured, stylish... many of the characteristics i find attractive about asian women.
i would imagine dating a feminist american woman might be a bit better, actually, than dating a normal white american girl... it shows strong character, which is really attractive. staunch feminists, i believe, probably have a lot of depth in that respect, but ultimately i think to myself, what is the point of dating someone who wants to eradicate gender differences. after all, we find the traits attractive from the opposite sex which we do not have ourselves. once you take all that out of the equation, there is no mystery and certainly no excitement left in romance.
many of my feminist-leaning white american female friends simply cannot come to terms with the fact that i like asian women. they make very rude comments, sometimes very denigrating and racist remarks. they see it as such a big threat. who knows why... maybe because it hurts them to see their male counterparts leaving the dating pool en masse.
when i see white american women i just subconsciously perceive them as being a "member of the opposite gender"--asexual friendly people and nothing more. it will most likely continue to be this way, i hope that is not what feminists really want to see happen.
as someone put it so brilliantly in another forum about this topic, "maybe white men are now running away from the frankensteins they created"
my $0.02
Anon2 — July 29, 2009
"i would imagine dating a feminist american woman might be a bit better, actually, than dating a normal white american girl… it shows strong character, which is really attractive. staunch feminists, i believe, probably have a lot of depth in that respect, but ultimately i think to myself, what is the point of dating someone who wants to eradicate gender differences. after all, we find the traits attractive from the opposite sex which we do not have ourselves. once you take all that out of the equation, there is no mystery and certainly no excitement left in romance."
The only "differences" they are trying to 'eradicate' would be the gender roles we keep seeing in the media. Where men 'should' be the breadwinner and women the housewife, and the whole manly men must be manly and womanly woman must be womanly. These kinds of things hurts both genders.
Would that make asian men more 'masculine' than white men, since there ARE many women whom are only attracted to asians as well? - and - How would you explain the homosexuals who also travel to asia to find a boy/girlfriend? Tokyo is well known for its gay bars in the community. After all, you say we find traits attractive from the opposite sex. Homosexual couples would take away that equation.
"many of my feminist-leaning white american female friends simply cannot come to terms with the fact that i like asian women. they make very rude comments, sometimes very denigrating and racist remarks. they see it as such a big threat. who knows why… maybe because it hurts them to see their male counterparts leaving the dating pool en masse."
There are plenty of white men who also go through this whole "OH NOEZ" when they see a white women dating a man outside their 'dating pool'. Many asians i've met feel uncomfortable with guys/girls who only want to date them for being asian, and I understand that. Unfortunately, that discomfort seems to be ignored.
"when i see white american women i just subconsciously perceive them as being a “member of the opposite gender”–asexual friendly people and nothing more. it will most likely continue to be this way, i hope that is not what feminists really want to see happen."
I see it more as your own sexual attraction towards asian women, I don't see how feminists has anything to do with it.
"as someone put it so brilliantly in another forum about this topic, “maybe white men are now running away from the frankensteins they created”"
So... men created feminism and independent white women?
Brown Shirt — July 29, 2009
"I just can’t help but wonder why certain people must go out of the country to find a mate. And it’s always those men who have a profound disrespect for females."
umm, Jeana, you mean American feminists, not females. Then, yes, you are absolutely correct. Yes, you and your ilk can't help but constantly wonder why men joyfully go out of the country to bask in the bevy of true cellulite-free femininity (and good hygiene to boot). You would all wonder less by looking in the mirror. If ya did, then all the blogs, "academic" writing, and repetitive tired diatribes on this one subject would cease. Finally. But dont do that because we all really like goading and infuriating feminists over this very subject *while* we walk on white sandy beaches holding the hands of our loyal deferential squaws. A toast to Jeana - hip hip hooray!
And to make you feel better, please feel free to convince yourself that they are all under the age of 14 as you have already done in one of your earlier diatribes (posts) since any man who desires young slim adult women must also be into children. In fact, these men must be so profoundly psychotic (aka antifeminist) they also chase down dogs and goats for sex.
Elena — July 29, 2009
i was just in europe recently as well… the women are not quite up to par with asian women IMO but leaps and bounds above the idea of the normal white american woman. they are cultured, stylish… many of the characteristics i find attractive about asian women.
Ahahahaha. Like feminism is an unheard-of thing round here in Europe. You're in denial.
(And by the way, you wouldn't know how high-maintenance those gorgeous Japanese girls are. When I was there earlier this year I was amazed at the sheer quantity of beauty products marketed at Japanese women, from facial cleansing gels --Japanese women tend to have greasy skin-- to industrial-strength shampoo so your hair doesn't get fried with the daily morning blow-dry to get those cute but totally artificial curls. I even got a nice konjaku sponge for scrubbing my face at a blotting paper store)
Brown Shirt — July 29, 2009
Short Elena-
The cat fight begins
YES!!
Elena — July 29, 2009
Oh, vete a tomar por culo, imbécil ^_^
whoknowswhy — July 29, 2009
@Anon2
"The only “differences” they are trying to ‘eradicate’ would be the gender roles we keep seeing in the media. Where men ’should’ be the breadwinner and women the housewife, and the whole manly men must be manly and womanly woman must be womanly. These kinds of things hurts both genders."
while that might be debatable, it is undeniable that the end result of feminism in america doesn't follow your line. where is a woman's place in american society these days? she supposedly can't make as much as men do, and most american girls don't fulfill the traditional female role either. so, what do they have to offer come time of marriage and when kids are born? i cook and clean... i love to cook, actually. maybe this will be hard for you to believe, but my most of my male american friends are all also really good cooks. the same cannot be said about any of my past white american girlfriends and female friends. i kid you not, none of them knew how to cook nor clean. not even just for themselves. i think the american woman today is not expected to do many of the things she once was expected to, but men are still expected to fulfill their roles and now also do the traditional female parts. not only that, but we are supposed to let feminist women tell us that we are terrible for wanting women that are lady-like in any way. the thing that bothers me about feminism is that men are so vilified, but actually the truth is that men feel just as much pressure from society in a myriad of different ways as women do. but, i digress...
"Would that make asian men more ‘masculine’ than white men, since there ARE many women whom are only attracted to asians as well? – and – How would you explain the homosexuals who also travel to asia to find a boy/girlfriend? Tokyo is well known for its gay bars in the community. After all, you say we find traits attractive from the opposite sex. Homosexual couples would take away that equation."
well, maybe attraction to asian women isn't all about how "feminine" they are perceived to be. you have a good point there... attraction does indeed work on many levels. but i don't understand what you're getting at... i could easily argue that asian men could indeed be considered more "masculine" by some women because they are stereotyped to be chauvinist and uncompromising with women. something that most american have certainly left behind.... oh, say after the 1950's. for homosexuals the main importance is that their partner is the same gender, but in reality in most homosexual relationships there is a person who takes on the masculine role and another who takes on the feminine role. so, your argument doesn't hold water there.
"There are plenty of white men who also go through this whole “OH NOEZ” when they see a white women dating a man outside their ‘dating pool’. Many asians i’ve met feel uncomfortable with guys/girls who only want to date them for being asian, and I understand that. Unfortunately, that discomfort seems to be ignored."
true, everyone has their issues... truth is, interracial dating is still more taboo than people are willing to admit. the author in this article says:
"The idea, specifically, that Asian women are more passive and deferential than white women, has been used to explain white men’s fetish for Asian women"
calling "asian fetish" is a double-edged sword. first and foremost, it is meant to attack the white man in question. no doubt, that's the obvious part, but the more subtle purpose is actually to also put down the woman. look at the definition of fetish in a dictionary; it is a sexual attraction to an object that is NOT NORMALLY considered sexual. psychologists do not recognize "asian fetish" as an actual fetish (for what may now be obvious reasons to you). there is no room for a "racial" fetish in the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders. so the end result is the white man is attackedin character, and the asian woman gets dehumanized because errr ya know, asian women aren't NORMALLY considered attractive therefore you must have some psychological fetish (read condition) to like them.
grrr.
yeah, it must be frustrating for asian women to go through that experience of only wanting to be dated for being asian. but they are not so special in that way... there are plenty of men who will want to date a woman just for having huge tits, or for being blonde or blue-eyed, whatever it is. blondes are stereotyped to be "wild party girls", but somehow i think it's only when the race card comes into play that it makes people truly uncomfortable. if a white woman wants to go to italy and be seduced by some stereotypical italian guy or go to france and get wine and dined by a parisian, then she just "has a thing for italian or french guys". but when a white woman wants to go to jamaica looking for a black man, then it becomes more than just a "thing" and the subject of frustration (mostly from black women and white men).
"So… men created feminism and independent white women?"
no, that's not what i meant. i kinda regret writing that, but i just think that (in light of some of the things i mentioned above), men in america let women get away with a lot in our society. we feel guilty about asking our girlfriends to do things for us, and feel guilty especially when it comes to our sexual desires and behaviors. we let women make us feel bad for the very things that make us human and considered "men" in society.
meh. whatever, i say to each his/her own. if you want a guy who is less traditional, go find one. if you want a woman who is less traditional, by all means... i guess it just bothers me to read feminist propaganda with the undertones that it's wrong to like asian women because they are more traditionally feminine, and you know... somehow that's not fair to white feminist women in america that guys go after them?
Elena — July 29, 2009
On a less European-stylish note, I'd like to tell our Wapanese friends that there's a recent post at his blog about eyelid glue, which is favoured by Asian women, as well as circle lenses. And please let me point you to a treasure trove of ulzzang makeover videos, so you get the making of an Asian beauty.
Seriously, guys, you're so funny.
whoknowswhy — July 29, 2009
"Ahahahaha. Like feminism is an unheard-of thing round here in Europe. You’re in denial. "
no, let's not be confused... feminism in europe is a very different thing. and european women have very different attitudes. it is not an apples to apples comparison.
SarahMC — July 29, 2009
I am not judging or criticizing anyone on the basis of their sex or whom they choose to date. You are GIVING me plenty of material to work with in your COMMENTS!
All you Japan-fetishists speak about women (Western and Asian alike) as though we are nothing more than natural resources, manufactured by nations in order to please men (you know, the REAL people). You assume Asian women must love being thought of as the pinnacle of femininity by white guys; you are wrong. Get to know some Japanese (or whomever) women as people rather than just fuck-toys and arm-candy, and you might hear that they do not appreciate being stereotyped by white men who project their OWN ideas about Asian women onto every Asian woman they encounter. Trust me; feminists have nothing against Asian women - in fact you may be surprised to learn that many feminist women ARE ASIAN!
What are you going to do if your perfect Japanese wife decides she's sick of going through a three-hour beauty routine every day? Find a new country of women to put on a pedestal?
Jesus, the logic fails are everywhere.
Frank Johnson — July 29, 2009
Boy, these fat queer lesbian feminist pigs that think they know everything. I have news for you arrogant, egocentric, lonely, angry and bitter oinkers. YOU KNOW NOTHING! You prove it with each post you make. Which taxpayer funded feminist organization do you work for? NOW or maybe the Iranian Religious Cult, the Bahai Faith and their U.S. Cell, the Tahirih Justice Center? You have nothing better to do with your pathetic lives than to bitch about men and foreign women. Obviously no man in your life (or should I say no woman in your life?)
I like foreign women. They are REAL women. You “don’t like” it? Tough sh*t. I could care less what you think. You try to badmouth foreign women yet all of you combined couldn’t touch the FEMINITY in one of their little toes. American (un)feminists are the most undesirable women in the World. Read your posts and look in the mirror at your fat, round faces and your double chins and your fat obese hairy barnbutts. What man in his right mind would want a (retch) “woman” like that? Better to go without a woman than to marry a nagging, bitching, complaining, self centered American feminist who will divorce you in six months and take you for every cent she can. Hell it is hard enough for YOU to find another fat queer lesbian feminist pig – probably because you both want to be the “man” or should I say dyke.
Go ahead. Try to belittle me. I could give a damn what you pathetic fat little slugs think. Complain how foreign women make you insecure because you know they are superior to you. Who cares what you losers have to say? You are peons. Little minds and huge bodies. Oh yeah. Tell us how “hot” you are and what a great figure you have. We don’t believe it for a minute. Nothing but wishful thinking. But most of all we could care less what you think and don’t give a damn what you say because it is all pure BS!
Onik Oink! Squeal. Suweeee! Suweeee! Why don’t you FO and die and let some REAL women talk for a change?
jeana — July 29, 2009
Brown Shirt,
So all you really want are very thin females. You posted a link to a show called “More to Love”, which apparently disgusts you. I really, really hope you yourself have about 11% body fat.
You think feminists are all ugly (“You would all wonder less by looking in the mirror”), fat & smelly (“you and your ilk can’t help but constantly wonder why men joyfully go out of the country to bask in the bevy of true cellulite-free femininity (and good hygiene to boot)”) and you want submissive wives (“holding the hands of our loyal deferential squaws”). Do you know or understand that “sqaw” is a racial slur?
And the funny thing is how shallow MRAs say women are. Only after a guy’s money. And will only date men with great jobs (because if you look around, only the richest males are married, right?).
There’s really no point in responding to you. I would like you to know, though, that you are not actually infuriating feminists by leaving the country to find sex partners. The more of you that leave, the better.
whoknowswhy — July 29, 2009
@SarahMC
no one here implied that you can't be asian and feminist at the same time more than the original author did. in fact, she propagated the entire idea herself.
it might burst your bubble to say this, but when it comes to dating, many people DO think rationally. put down the man-hating filtering lens you see society through for one second, and realize that your interpretation is unwarranted. when people are looking for a partner (whether man or woman), they are looking for fulfillment... whether it be emotionally or physically or spiritually or even maybe on a superficial level. some place more importance on one thing than others... but ultimately we, as men, want to be with the best just as women want the same from their male partners.
you could call it a give-and-take approach, or rationalism, but to say we treat women as natural resources is taking it a bit too far. of course i am concerned about what a woman can do for me in a relationship. is it so wrong to say that? aren't you also concerned about what your boyfriend and husband can do to increase the quality of your life??
i feel bad that you have had such terribel experiences that make you feel this way. but when looking at the picture realistically, many asian women do prefer to date white men, so your argument that they hate the way white men perceive them must not hold true for this group of women, at least.
there are some things wrong and some things right about the whole phenomenon. if you are just looking for some asian trophy wife, then you will face disappointment at one point or another. the most important thing about relationships is that both people can fulfill what is expected of each other. some people are superficial, that is a given and covers both men and women. but, you tell me what woman (feminist or not) finds a dirt poor short man with a sensitive heart and soft voice a sunny prospect for dating. do all women (feminist or not) gravitate to balding men the same way they do to men with a full head of hair?
don't put yourself on a pedestal, we are all in it together and share the same flaws across races and genders.
Matt K — July 29, 2009
"You are peons."
ROFL.
I wouldn't be surprised if that were some delicious copypasta right there. But please, keep going, prove our points for us.
And please, refrain from lumping me in when you talk about how women demean "us", as earlier comments have. I'd rather not be included in the ranks of the He-Man Wimminz Haterz Club.
Elena — July 29, 2009
Frank, some of us are actually foreign women. And we still think misogynists like you are assholes outside your USA.
whoknowswhy "no, let’s not be confused… feminism in europe is a very different thing. and european women have very different attitudes. it is not an apples to apples comparison."
I'm an European feminist, and you're neither. Don't you try mansplaining my attitude to me. That you're treating Europe as a big homogeneous block only shows that you don't know anything about us.
Matt K — July 29, 2009
Wow, I don't think I've ever heard the word "mansplaining" before. That is awesome, and I will deploy it at my earliest convenience.
whoknowswhy — July 29, 2009
okay, it's getting to that point now where i'm feeling that my time has been wasted. it was fun while it lasted... in short, i don't feel guilty or ashamed for liking what i like... and those who argue that i shouldn't be that way... they should look inside themselves a bit first and think about what this means to them rather than looking toward the outside and pointing fingers and crying injustice.
i'm not here to change the point of view of every woman with a chip on her shoulder about the fact that many western men prefer foreign women. "mansplaining"... that's great. you just provided yet another example of how women get the carte blanche to put down and attack men and call us names.
but you should really stop bitching about the dating pool shrinking when you don't even see your male counterparts on a respectful level. it is just so annoyingly hypocritical.
jeana — July 29, 2009
whoknowswhy:
“when you don’t even see your male counterparts on a respectful level’
Respectable like Frank Johnson at 10:40 am today? Respectable like that? You’re crying about Elaina using the word ““mansplaining” and say, “you just provided yet another example of how women get the carte blanche to put down and attack men and call us names.”
Call YOU names?
Look at Frank Johnson’s post. He refers to us as “fat queer lesbian feminist pigs”, he says “American (un)feminists are the most undesirable women in the World”, and “look in the mirror at your fat, round faces and your double chins and your fat obese hairy barnbutts”.
It never ceases to amaze me at the feigned shock MRAs express at a female saying something like “mansplaining” and yet completely ignore one of their brothers using words far more insulting and degrading. You people do this all the time. You should go to glennsacks.com. There you will find solace with like-minded hatemongers like Frank Johnson. There you can degrade and insult women and especially feminists and you will be celebrated for your enlightened ideas. Bye bye.
SarahMC — July 29, 2009
Amazing, isn't it Jeana? I get accused of being a man-hating "reverse sexist" for using sarcasm but Mr. RoidRage up there goes off on a truly bigoted rant, full of stereotypes and threats, and these MRAs are blind to it. And even after we explain our position, over and over and over, they still depict us as hating Asian women. Naw, guys, we hate patriarchy and the men who fight to perpetuate it (i.e. you).
jeana — July 29, 2009
You can’t say anything to an MRA without them getting into a rage. Once I joked that men are beasts and women are tamers of the beasts. It was a joke. I don’t think men are beasts. But I never heard the end of it. A “normal” guy would have thrown something back like “maybe we’re beasts but at least we don’t change our minds a hundred times”. But MRAs respond viciously, as though I said I drink the blood of infant boys (for the record, I don’t).
Anyway, I think that if more guys weren’t so obsessed with female weight, they could find a nice girlfriend who would love them and make them happy. There are plenty of nice females who aren’t bombshells and aren’t given a chance. Males aren’t the only ones who have unrealistic expectations of this order, of course. But the sentiments expressed on this thread about fat girls make me think that these particular guys might be a little shallow. And unhappy.
SarahMC — July 29, 2009
"Fat" as a slur. "Lesbian" as a slur. It reveals a lot, and I guarantee a lot of these men are fat themselves. And there's nothing wrong with that, besides the hypocrisy.
Frank Johnson — July 30, 2009
Gee I was just "kidding" too. It is so easy to get you "know it alls" riled up. Like casting out a worm to catch a fat whale. An easy catch.
Jeana, your ego is as huge as your barnbutt. You think the world hangs on to your every word? It doesn't. You are only impressing yourself with your small ability to put two words together.
For every true post like mine, there are a million out there where feminists say things far, far worse about regular men and foreign women. How come you don't complain about the feminists' comments? Because you have been (easily) brainwashed only to complain about men, that's why.
You want respect? Show it, otherwise you don't deserve it even though you expect it and demand complete submission from men. I guess there are not enough brainwashed eunuchs out there to satisfy your need of control. Too bad for you that the majority of men are not eunuchs and could give a damn less what you think and even less of what you demand.
Feminists. A dying breed soon to be extinct. Good riddance to insecure, ranting, demanding, fat queer lesbian rubbish. Not quite women - not quite men but a little of both. Freaks of nature. They will not be missed.
Matt K — July 30, 2009
OMG shoez!
Elena — July 30, 2009
"For every true post like mine, there are a million out there where feminists say things far, far worse about regular men and foreign women."
Ah, the old "there are imaginary people out there that are worse than me, so nyah nyah" tactic. Also known as "But we're not as bad as Hitler!" approach to discourse.
http://derailingfordummies.com/#butbut
Elena — July 30, 2009
Oh, and "Gee I was just “kidding” too. It is so easy to get you “know it alls” riled up."
http://derailingfordummies.com/#surprise
We could make a bingo card!
Frank Johnson — July 30, 2009
Elena there is an old saying that was made just for you "It is better to be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt."
You must be truly lonely as there is nobody (man or woman) who could possibly love you as much as you love yourself.
Pathetic, lonely and insignificant (but hugely fat). You and Jeana would probably make a great queer lesbian feminist couple if you could ever agree on who would be the "husband" and who would be the "wife." Whew! What a disgusting thought. Barf retch gag!
Elena — July 30, 2009
Yeah, when you guys resort to "you're fat and ugly and who would fuck you anyway," you've thoroughly lost the argument.
Ryan — July 30, 2009
This might be a little off topic, but I work at a video game publisher with a lot of nerds so the grown men loving fictional characters part resonated with me.
I often notice that Science Fiction and Anime have a lot of sexy "robots" or "cyborgs". Look at Seven of Nine in Star Trek Voyager, the Blonde Cylon from Battle Star Galactica, or the Major in Ghost in the Shell. These women conform to a high sexualized physical "ideal" while at the same time being almost completely devoid of "feminine" traits such as being "high strung", "irrational", or "over emotional". It seems to me like there are alot of men out there (and I would assume women to) who wouldn't mind a partner who completely "programmable" or logical to the point that they a socially stunted "nerd" would be able to interact with them much more easily than the "misadropic" women that they deal with "in the real world". When human technology is able to over come the uncanny valley and create machines real enough for us to love and have a relationship what will that mean for real human interaction? What are the rights of these machines? It isn't inconceivable that we will be able to developer non-organic entities who's neural functions will lead them to believe that they are alive?
Can you imagine if your computer wouldn't let you post comments to Soci Images because they didn't "feel" like it?
Americorps — July 31, 2009
I'm not defending Delphi's attack on feminism, but I do agree with him that your views on dating are a bit extreme.
I support the Constitution, and believe it gives people the right to freely communicate and meet through free-will message boards where people simply rent space to post messages to meet friends or romantic partners. Paying for the right to post messages is not the same as paying to have someone presented to you for marriage, and you simply lie if you claim otherwise. These Google ads promote the former, not the latter.
If a woman is harmed by someone, you cannot hold any dating, matchmaking or other introduction service responsible for her mal treatment. She is not, the dating service is not, and Google is not responsible, only the abuser is.
Furthermore, there are a million ways a man can meet a woman or a woman can meet a man, to blame one venue is iresponsible at best. If you would really like to be effective at changing the world, you would be better suited to education women on their rights and responsibilities, such as NOW and other women's organizations do, to help arm women with opportunities and education to make more informed choices and to know more about the dangers that lurk.
This is how you fix the problem... not by attacking men you deem to be "losers" or trying to shut down venues through which they meet women. If you do that, then would you call for regulation of the printing press becuase a man might print and distribute fliers to meet a woman for marriage, or the newspapers because he might place a classified ad for a wife, or the airlines becaue he might use them to travel and meet a wife? Of course not, and it's the same thing!
Nevin — August 1, 2009
I think that among all kinds of marketing approaches, direct marketing works perfectly for moms as moms could be easily influenced by other moms.
Sky — August 1, 2009
I think in the modern society, few companies could afford to neglect the purchase power of women. This market segment is playing a key role, especially in the retailing business.
Tian — August 1, 2009
You obviously put a lot of work into that post and its very interesting to see the thought process that you went through to come up with those conclusion. Thanks for sharing your deep thoughts. I must admit that I think you nailed it on this one.
Delphi_Pro — August 2, 2009
QUOTE FROM JEANA:
Anyway, I think that if more guys weren’t so obsessed with female weight, they could find a nice girlfriend who would love them and make them happy. There are plenty of nice females who aren’t bombshells and aren’t given a chance. Males aren’t the only ones who have unrealistic expectations of this order, of course. But the sentiments expressed on this thread about fat girls make me think that these particular guys might be a little shallow. And unhappy.
It goes both ways missy. If women weren't so obsessed with age, then they would find a lot of sincere, honest, faithful and loyal husbands who would treat you like queens. "Oh my God, he's 35!!!!"... I can't date him, he's "old enough to be my father!!!".... And you wonder why we look for love in countries like the Philippines where you're allowed to be "over 30" and still be considered "a catch".
Some of us don't have our college degrees, professional positions, six figure salaries and our own 5-bedroom houses... all before the age of 25! And you talk about unrealistic expectations.
And by the way, I'm not talking about 18-year old girls here... I'm talking about women well up in their 20's who think 35 is too old! And many of you 35- to 40-year old women out there are hooking up with 20-year old guys these days. Talk about hypocrisy!
Frank Johnson — August 2, 2009
Elena showed her jealousy (and presumably hatred of) Asian women a few of her posts ago implying they only look pretty because they spend hours putting makeup on. Ha Ha Gee good thing American women NEVER buy makeup not to mention most normal women worldwide. I realize feminists never buy the stuff because (1) they mistakingly think they are so (gag) "hot" they don't need it or (2) they realize it wouldn't do any good because men don't want them anyway so they can buy more food to feed their barnbutts.
The "best looking" feminist couldn't compare to the homeliest Asian woman even if the feminist used a gallon of makeup.
Matt K — August 3, 2009
Huh, I didn't think "GTFO" was that nuanced a concept, but MRAs have proven me wrong once again.
Scalian — August 3, 2009
No, Mat, I think you prove yourself wrong yourself.
A male feminist? WTF??
If you're a man, why don't you start acting like one?
Matt K — August 3, 2009
And hark, just when I thought I could lol no more, obvious trolls were there to help.
Frank Johnson — August 4, 2009
You should know "Matt" (aka Rumpelstiltskin.)
I'm afraid the feminists had "Matt's" balls for lunch a long time ago. Sorry "Matt" but if you read enough real men's comments, you may learn how to grow them back. Maybe.....
Until then decide if you want to be satisfied being a eunuch under control of your feminist masters or if you want to be a male instead.
Tlönista — August 4, 2009
Uh, Matt...about your balls...well, you know how we members of the Fat Queer Angry Feminist Cabal have been on rotation keeping them under lock and key? Well, I had them safely stored in Tupperware in the freezer, but when I was out at work my roommates, zealously cleaning house due to the garbage strike ending, mistook them for leftover pickled onions and...er...threw them out.
There is such a large amount of garbage being processed that tracking down any particular bag is like finding a needle in a haystack.
They're gone, man.
Sorry.
If you want to go over to the Dark Side, we totally understand.
Matt K — August 4, 2009
:(
Joanna — August 4, 2009
FRANK QUOTE : "I'm afraid the feminists had "Matt's" balls for lunch a long time ago".
Enough real men's comments? So am I to believe that a real man is the type that accuses anyone who disagrees with him either lacking a set of balls or just a lonely fat lesbian that no one could love. Given your initial posts, you seemed like a man who at least had some kind of opinion and logical flow of thoughts that you wished to express. Fair enough. In an open forum it should be expected that conflicting views will be posited.
However, to then just accuse someone as being 'not a real man' on the sole basis that he sides with the feminists, or that Elena and Jena must clearly be the 2 fattest, ugliest, loneliest women in the world because they are feminists only makes you come across as uneducated and a bigot to be quite blunt. I suppose the flip side is that if you're what constitutes a "real man" then you are just some bulked up ex-football player that has had 1 too many hits to the head to articulate intelligent arguments, eats bowls of creatine for breakfast and thinks that his ideal woman is not too bright but she sure is pretty little thing.
I'm going to go ahead and say that a REAL MAN is one that can not only accept men and women as equals, but can articulate this fact in a civilized manner (ie without resorting to calling people fat or emasculated). I apparently have more faith in real men than you seem to.
Oh and just so you know how to insult me properly if you so feel the need - yes I am a woman, no I don't consider myself a "raging feminist" or an "evil MRA" but actually an egalitarian. Also no I'm not fat and yes I have a boyfriend who loves me. So work with that as you will.
Ace — August 4, 2009
"Sorry “Matt” but if you read enough real men’s comments, you may learn how to grow them back. Maybe….."
Because you, dear sir, are a Real Man.
Right. Even most 16-year-old boys don't have the disrespect and name-calling behavior you harbor.
Tom Becker — August 5, 2009
Listen to the sanctimony here.
You bash us and call us "bride purchasers" and "consumer-husbands", and make remarks that "real men" wouldn't go to poor countries where women have no prospects and are desperate to marry someone just to get "food in their bellies", and we're supposed to cower, crawl into a corner and bow our heads in shame.
When somebody dishes the same kind of bashing, name-calling diatribe to you, albiet it was crude, you scream and cry foul play. All of a sudden you're the victim and we're your attackers.
If you want to bash, demean and belittle people without knowing ANYTHING about them, their history, their backgrounds or the circumstances surrounding their choices, then don't be surprised when someone attacks you back.
I didn't call you a fat queer lesbian pig... not that you don't deserve to be called that. I also don't go around calling people "spouse purchasers" and "desperate losers" because of how and where they met their partner. Remember you launched the first attack.
People who live in glass houses..........
Delphi_Programmer — August 5, 2009
Ok, it's gotten way out of hand.
I never meant to attack "feminism" in general; despite that I do think at least some of it is reverse sexism. I had hoped this thread wouldn't degrade to the point that it has.
There are a lot of noble causes that women's groups have fought tirelessly for over the years, and much good has come from their efforts. However, when it comes to international dating and marriage, I feel that a lot of mis-information has been promoted, leading to mis-guided anger and dissent.
I appreciate your concern for the safety and well-being of women. Your goals are noble but your methods are questionable. You attack all men who meet women through international personal ads and dating services, but you don't know these people. You've never sat down with them, learned their history or empathized with the circumstances that lead them to where they are. Instead you simply judge and stereotype them.
I wouldn't care what a bunch of bloggers who, for all I know could be 16-year old high school kids, say in a message thread like this. However, Google searches lead all kinds of people to these stories and they influence public opinion. Influence public opinion and you influence law. Don't we already have enough nanny state law putting us in chains and handcuffs? Do you really think you can arbitrarily take away individual freedom and not have it affect you one day?
All I want is that the truth be told. Honesty and integrity are what I care about. Through all of the mud slinging, name calling and crude language, a very subtle lie is being spread. The lie is that people "pay" people to marry them. We live in the 21st century folks! This doesn't happen today. I have been to the Philippines six times, know four couples who met the way I did, and am in constant contact with people who meet and date, or who have married, foreigners from multiple countries. I have never met anyone who paid an agency or individual for marriage. Unless, of course, by "paying for marriage" you're referring to the "she married him for his money" hyperbole that is spread around like a literal truth. That isn't true either, despite how adamantly you cling to these stereotypes. Understand the difference between truth and hyperbole.
Please, you can think whatever you want to think of people you disagree with, but try to maintain honesty and integrity in your reporting and message posting.
Ace — August 5, 2009
I am honestly confused on why you would go to a specific "foreign dating site" to meet women without some other motive. Some reason to want a foreign woman SPECIFICALLY. I'm wondering why you go after foreign women specifically, instead of just using a general dating site. Enlighten me?
Brown Shirt — August 6, 2009
Hey Ace
Do you mean this foreign dating site:
http://www.match.com/international/index.aspx
Cannot figure out why American men would go there, but the owner of the site sure is making a mint based on the fact that they do.
Frank Johnson — August 6, 2009
Gee Ace, do you suppose that maybe so many guys seek foreign women could be because they are attracted to them? (like feminists are attracted to food and each other.)
Foreign women are attractive inside and out, have traditional “old fashioned” values, are family oriented and make a wonderful partner in life (all attributes sorely lacking in most American women.) “local” marriages have a failure (divorce) rate of 50 % (not very good odds) while international marriages have a SUCCESS rate in the high 90 % range. Why? Because both parties are seeking the same thing – a lifelong happy marriage with mutual love and respect for each other. In the majority of cases, they find it.
With the majority of “local” American/American marriages you have a domineering, self centered, immature woman that is “lost” and needs to “find herself” and ends up divorcing the poor guy and taking him for every cent she can. Add substance abuse and becoming (even more) obese on top of it and you have a recipe for divorce. If she is a feminist, divorce is almost a guarantee. Also since it is a fact that most domestic abuse is done by women, more and more men are turned off to American women.
American women’s reputation for making terrible wives is well known worldwide. This why even foreign men are not interested in them.
The International Marriage Broker, Match.com/International is well aware of this which is why they feature so many more foreign women than they do American women.
Feminists, as you might well imagine, hate foreign women which is really ironic because foreign women are so ultra feminine while feminists are not feminine in the least. Nothing makes a feminist more angry than to see an American male happy, especially if he is happily married to a foreign woman who is so obviously superior to her.
So Ace, it just comes down to a matter of preference and even more important, freedom of choice along with civil rights guaranteed by our American Constitution even though there are some who would like to see those rights denied to men (and eventually women too.)
Iranian-American Layli Miller-Muro and her Iranian radical religious cult, The Bahai Faith, and their branch in the USA, the taxpayer funded Tahrih Justice Center, comes first to mind…….
Delphi_Programmer — August 6, 2009
I'd like to point out that most men don't go to foreign dating sites "specifically" to "seek out" a foreign lady as you contend.
Most single people play the field and go wherever they can to seek potential partners, which may include foreign as well as domestic dating sites in addition to the normal local venues (bars, etc.).
When I was single I met women through church singles groups, bars, nightclubs and local dating services. I also took dancing lessons and met some people that way. I then expanded my opportunities by placing and answering ads in magazine and newspaper personals columns and, yes, writing to foreign dating columns. I finally met my Philippine wife through Cherry Blossoms. I found her to be more attractive, desirable and she possessed the character qualities I was looking for. I didn't marry her because she came from the Philippines, she just happened to come from there and I found her more to my liking than the women I met elsewhere. As a rule, I found women from the Philippines to be generally more attractive; however, that doesn't mean I wouldn't have married a girl from Kentucky if I had found one to my liking. I kept all doors open. What is so wrong with having a preference?
Why would you people want to limit choices? Why would you want to box people in and tell them where they are and aren't allowed to seek a dating or marriage partner?
Alienati0n — August 6, 2009
“The idea, specifically, that Asian women are more passive and deferential than white women, has been used to explain white men’s fetish for Asian women”
So this isn't about the fact that Women of Color need a more diverse representation as being desired in the media, because that's a threat, but white women fearing competition because it doesn't support their privilege. It's "normal" for men to be attracted to white women since they are naturally more desirable after all, and preferring any other women is somehow abnormal and a "fetish".
I don't see these very white women speaking up on black women's behalf when THEY as white women are considered more feminine and docile and black men choose them. This is in spite of the fact that black women ARE actually more docile unfortunately, when it comes to the standards we are "allowed" to exercise in male choices and are often silent, don't report rape, etc.,
For example, how many white feminists brought up that the reason why men of ALL ethnicities are tripping over themselves to be with plain white women is because of this very *assumed* femininity? However, as one poster put up it's because Asian women wear more make up (what?!)
Why no cries for the women in Asia; white feminists, when they are getting side effects from using toxic skin bleach since in *globalism* makeup companies STILL feature the whitest of every ethnicity. This is a world phenomon (youtube "fair and lovely" for example).
Why no outrage when Beyonce looks closer to white every time we see her, when actresses are chosen because they are "half white" to play black latina and asian female characters. Why no outcries when JLO has to play an italian woman to get a role? Or why no cries against the fact that Halle can play a fully black stereotypical female, but not a white one? ALL of this ALL of this is because of white female supremacy.
When Queen Latifah is in a covergirl commercial next to a white skinny and "desirable" female model, I don't have to ask myself that if this were reversed (say Roseanne was a covergirl while Rihanna was front and center) it simply WOULD NOT happen. I also RARELY hear white feminist protest the images of obese black woman, the muscular black woman (both are done to highlight white femininity as the "black minstrel" was done to highlight white male mental superiority). "Oh but black women embracing obesity is positive and pro feminist" I hear. Although there are millions of obese white women in America, NEVER depicted in pop culture. Why?
When "so and so" white male hunk actor ends up with an attractive asian companion (in REAL life since we never see asian women in movies as it's a direct threat to white female superiority) all of a sudden it's because she MUST be submissive. No outcries of "feminism" for Tiger Woods ending up with a domestic nanny, because she's blond, white and therefore feminine and submissive by default right?
In fact, I RARELY hear white feminists advocate for more representation of positive and desirable asian women in Hollywood. But PLENTY have an opinion on the increase of asian women "stealing" their good white men?
If people want to preserve white supremacy (which is exactly white female femininity privilege is, only white women go unchallenged on this because this racism is considered ' natural catty female behavior' please AT LEAST admit it.
This is your local black girl often considered a threat to white female supremacy for whatever reason.
Thank You :-)
A-i0n
Alienati0n — August 6, 2009
"Western women frequently make comments that our men are exotic, handsome, charming, “real men,” and family-oriented. It’s not rare to hear them putting down western men in comparison to the local men.
Actually, sometimes I think western women put up with things from our men that they wouldn’t put up with from a western man."
This is true, Anon, thank you for discussing REALITY as a lot of this convo is taking place between white femininity supremacists, and white male patriarchs.
I also think the opposite is true, that many women would put up with "more" from their cultures specific oppression than ours because they are socialized into it. This is applicable among African Americans, etc., in general women are more socialized to help "their" men and are indoctrinated to "stick" to their own even when other men have more to offer. I also learned while living in Cairo that Egyptian women are forbid from marrying foreigners while Egyptian men say "American women are more feminine" and heavily pursue foreign women exclusively.
"Foreign women" (whatever that means as an umbrella term) who come to America to marry ARE specifically rebelling against the patriarchy in their societies, if they come from an area that frowns down on women not marrying "their own", even if they might starve to death by sticking to "their own".
This particular indoctrinating is stronger in areas where women are expected to be "women" while the men of the ethnicity don't fit the "power expectation" of masculinity and don't keep up with their end of the bargain therefore, I've learned.
I've found this true with African American men demanding femininity when so many of them are unemployed and living off of the very women they criticize for not being "white looking". Perhaps Asian women being expected to be feminine (or white skinned) by Asian men, while Asian men don't meet the basic demands of masculinity being tall/muscular might also have relevance? There are several examples of this.
What I'm interested in is why women who are not considered "marriageable" because they are not white but dark skinned (and the stereotypes of BW are true of dark skinned women in Asia, Latin America, etc) because of global white female supremacy, I'm surprised it's not considered radical when men want these "undesirable" women of various ethnicities? Isn't WOC being desired for marriage in white supremacy the female equivalent to MOC being included in the workforce in the 60s?
There's no difference between being sold as a commodity for 15 sheep for marriage and a man buying a 5,000 dollar ring as a contract into marriage. Being married to economic stability gives a woman more privilege IN patriarchy. A foreign woman who trades in "culture" for a chance at privilege...Who am I to say she's not a feminist? I have NO CLUE if that's true, but I would never rule it out unless foreign women from various places personally told me so. I'm just saying that socialization of women is indeed very tricky (if you're not looking from a white American female's perspective).
A-i0n
Ace — August 6, 2009
"Foreign women are attractive inside and out, have traditional “old fashioned” values, are family oriented and make a wonderful partner in life (all attributes sorely lacking in most American women.)"
Yet again, you stereotype foreign women... this is a form of racism, in my opinion. Certainly not all foreign women have these attributes, as you would like to think.
Delphi, that is perfectly okay and I do not intend to take away your choices. However, I DO find something wrong with assuming that all foreign women have traditional values, and specifically going out to seek a foreign woman because of that, as Frank seems to have done.
"especially if he is happily married to a foreign woman who is so obviously superior to her."
Right. Perhaps superior in your mind, but there is no objective measure of inferiority or superiority...
Delphi_Pro — August 7, 2009
Again I want to reiterate that I think race, color and ethnicity are way over emphasized here. When I started out I didn't have any particular preference, except that I wanted someone young, of prime marriage and child bearing age, and who wouldn't have excessive social or financial expectations of me. I also wanted someone who didn't have the baggage of a prior failed marriage and family in her past, complete with kids old enough to say, "Don't tell me what to do, you're not my Dad".
I didn't care if she was white or black, American, Latina or Asian. The women I met in bars and nightclubs were shallow and hung up on superficial things. The women I met in church singles groups were self-righteous, sanctimonious, judgmental and cliquish. When I started meeting through personal ads, the first woman I met got pregnant with a local boy before I even met her, despite numerous letters expressing that I'm "special" and "the one" for her. Other stateside women had other problems I chose not to put up with... such as compulsive lying, excessive insecurity and other things like that.
When I found Cherry Blossoms I wasn't looking for a Philippine woman in particular. It caught my eye because they featured international women's introductions (and, by the way, international men's introductions for the women... so it wasn't "sexist"). Through experience I found that many women from the Philippines were more open-minded, not hung up on superficial things, didn't care that men were *exactly* their age, and yet they were God-fearing and family-oriented without being judgmental like the Christians I met in the past. EVEN STILL, I continued to meet and date American women, including a girl 20 miles from my house whom I dated less than a year before I traveled to the Philippines to meet my wife.
I played the field, gave everybody a fair chance, and the girl from the Philippines won.
My whole point all along is that people should be free to meet, date and marry people wherever and however they find them. People who advocate for government control, laws and regulations are trying to build a nanny state. Government isn't your babysitter. We're all adults, and should be free to make our own choices and responsible to live with the consequences of those choices.
There is no such thing as a "mail order bride". That term is grossly overused and it's meaning is completely misconstrued. No one "buys" or "sells" women, and no one "pays" to marry anyone. Those ideas are pure hyperbole, designed to create hysteria.
Anonymous — August 8, 2009
"There is no such thing as a “mail order bride”. That term is grossly overused and it’s meaning is completely misconstrued. No one “buys” or “sells” women, and no one “pays” to marry anyone. Those ideas are pure hyperbole, designed to create hysteria."
lol
Frank Johnson — August 8, 2009
That is right. There is no such thing as a "mail order bride." There were back in the 1800's literally and yes, it was mainly AMERICAN women who were the brides and I'm sure the vast majority were happy to be able to decide for themselves to make their decision. (They didn't have taxpayer funded feminists back then to decide for them what they should think and do, unlike now.)
However in the late 1900's, when International Friendship Services/ Penpal Clubs For (gasp!) single adults entered the picture, American men and foreign women discovered they had a choice. If they wanted they could use the services of these places (free in the ladies' case because, being old fashioned, the Penpal Services thought the man should pay, like on a date, and that ALL women should be able to use the service free so every woman had a chance of meeting their special guy.) You would think the feminists would be happy with this "empowerment" for the foreign ladies. After all it is they who "pick and choose" which men, if any, they wish to reply back to, NOT the men contrary to what feminists would have you believe! The foreign WOMEN do the choosing and picking! Always have. Always will.
So how do the feminists respond to this FREEDOM OF CHOICE, ESPECIALLY FOR THE FOREIGN WOMEN? (Their foreign “sisters”, Ha Ha.)
They are bitter, angry, jealous, hate-filled and call (their “sisters”) the foreign women "prostitutes escaping desperate circumstances" (straight from a rice paddy of course) or gold diggers looking for a green card (in a wasted try to scare the men away from them and stop them from marrying American men and, gasp, seeing American men happily married to NON-feminists! Can’t have that!)
That went on for a few years and backfired on the fems because men aren’t stupid enough to fall for that feminist fabricated propaganda, even though the media couldn’t get enough of it. As more men became happily married to great devoted women and had beautiful kids, their divorced friends saw these happy couples and wanted a REAL wife also. Keep in mind, despite the feminists propaganda, the women were more happy then they ever thought possible, so much in fact, that they asked the Penpal Services to feature their friends, sisters, cousins, girlfriends, etc. so that they might have a chance to be happily married to a nice guy too. Word of mouth from HAPPY COUPLES!
So you have thousands and thousands of American men happily married to foreign ladies that were happily married to them. You see, unlike what IRANIAN-american Layli Miller-Muro of the Iranian radical religious cult, The Tahirih Justice Center, a taxpayer funded IRANIAN Bahai Faith FOR profit organization, all American men are NOT “premeditated torturers, serial rapists and pedophiles” who will sell their wives into brothels as soon as they step off the plane. Actually there has NEVER been such a thing happen although she spews it as fact! Did I also mention she has her head up her fat ass, is a serial liar and fact fabricator? At least she knows she is. My favorite is when she lies that ALL foreign women can’t speak English, while knowing damn well The Philippines is the THIRD LARGEST ENGLISH SPEAKING COUNTRY IN THE WORLD! In fact most countries in Asia have an extremely high English standard – better than the idiots in our public schools.
Okay so the foreign ladies are NOT whores and gold diggers after all. What approach to take next? Well, call them stupid, uneducated, helpless, non-English speaking dummies just waiting to be victims of leering, serial abusing, raping, beating, bashing, slashing, smashing horrible heterosexual American men. After all, if an American man seeks a nice foreign woman instead of an obese, bossy, demanding, angry, bitter, hateful American feminist then there MUST be something wrong with him, right? He MUST be a criminal or at least a potential one, right? WRONG and a complete LIE of course.
But you can’t tell that to the media or gullible politicians. However, let a feminist mention the word “abuse” to a politician, especially while screaming hysterically and he/she will have their ears covered and say “How much taxpayer money did you need to shut your fat loud mouth up?”
Then out of hundreds of thousands of International Marriages, some actual abuse in the form of murder, actual number 2 or 3 , (or a million depending on which lying feminist you talk to) happens even though the couple didn’t meet through a Penpal service and the man had NO prior criminal history and WOW! Something MUST be done about the “millions” of foreign women who are being slaughtered daily by these psychopaths! We feminists MUST stop these foreign women from meeting American men and marrying them. In fact, just to make sure, they shouldn’t even be allowed to say hi to the men or vice versa – ESPECIALLY vice versa. Prevent those male pigs from even saying hi to them. That is right up our feminist alley. Take away men’s rights while at the same time stopping those damn attractive non-feminist little whores from coming to the USA and messing up all of our “hard fought” feminist accomplishments over the past 30 years. We have the leashes. We just need to convince men why they should wear them willingly – and if they don’t want to wear them? MAKE THEM WEAR THEM, “willingly of course.” Hey, we are just “protecting” these women. We are so “concerned” about them, really! We can’t sleep at night because we worry about them so much.
There are some dumbasses out there who really think women are being mailed in boxes (hopefully with airholes) after a man picks them out of a “catalog” and “purchases” them. People that really believe human beings are being mailed to other people in boxes are called Morons, fools, brainless idiots, the media, gullible politicians and FEMINISTS!
There are some here. Prove me right!
Matt K — August 8, 2009
lol at MRAs arguing with themselves now.
Frank Johnson — August 10, 2009
Really Matt? Who? Nobody is arguing that I know of and I know a lot. A Hell of a lot more than you, in fact obviously. Ha Ha
Which catagory do YOU fall under? Moron, fool, brainless idiot or feminist (or all of them?) Please don't try to convince us you are a man just because you use a man's name. There are a lot of eunuchs out there still using male names while the feminists eat their balls for lunch. There are a lot of queer lesbian fat feminists posting as men. Right?
lol at femimales like you with no sac and even less brains.
Matt is probably a virgin and getting older and less attractive.
Anonymous — August 10, 2009
HAHA FRANK! I GOTTA SAY, I LOVE HOW YOU RESPOND IN PURE INSULTS AND A TL;DR FULL OF FALLACIES!
Now go back and fuck your submissive wife and try to get like 2-3 more children kay. Make sure you raise all your sons like the perfect prick you are.
Frank Johnson — August 10, 2009
Thank you. I am rather perfect aren't I?
Anonymous is so stupid he/she can't even think of a post name (unless you are THE original "Anonymous" whose name has been copied by millions and millions around the world. Nah! Not that smart.)
Although I suspect "Anonymous" is most likely Layli Miller-Muro of the Iranian Bahai Faith Cult or one of her taxpayer funded "volunteers" from her FOR-profit Tahirih Justice Center spreading hate with U.S. tax dollars.
"Anonymous" says my wife is "submissive" which shows how little "Anonymous" knows about my wife (or ANY heterosexual woman for that matter.) I'm sure his/her idea of sex is his hand (5 fingered Mary) or a nice big dildo. Don't be so jealous just because you have no idea what it is like to have sex with another human being who enjoys it.
As to "2-3 more children kay?" I'm not sure what "Anonymous" means by that but I assume her/his birth language is Farsi not English.
Ha Ha Ha Ha! "Anonymous": U R LOL
Americorps — August 13, 2009
Don't argue with Frank. He may be rude and crude, but he knows his stuff.
I tried to argue with him on the "Living in Peru" message thread that NOW is a good organization that has fought tirelessly to advance equal rights and equal opportunities and protection for women, but he and others showed me that a part of what I was arguing is in error.
As someone who cares about the CONSTITUTION and a FREE AMERICA, I reconsidered some of what these people were saying, and see things differently now.
I argued that "Paying a fee for the right to post a message is not the same as paying a fee to obtain a list of people who are presented to get married"; not realizing, of course, that I was in error thinking that a such service that actually "arranges marriages" exists in the 21st century.
I argued that "A free will meeting people site is not the same as a marriage broker, no matter how you spin it.", but was brainwashed by the modern feminist cartel that women are having their marriages arranged and have no choice in whom they end up with.
I made the point that Match.com and other dating sites are not marriage brokers, because ... "The marriage broker was the guy...he used a message board..he could have also taken out a classified ad, distributed posters around town or just showed up....", but again was under the false impression that someone kidnaps girls, ties them up with ropes and keeps them padlocked in a holding room until their "order" is filled by someone who purchases them through a catalog. What was I thinking?
Since "I am shocked and ashamed of any American that does not hold the foundation of our democracy as sacred", as I argued then, I have seen the light and believe that any service that introduces single people; whether they fit the "profile" of a "marriage broker" or not, should be protected by the constitutional rights of free speech and free assembly.
You, your activist groups or the Government are not their nannies. These are mature adult women, I don't see why they need government regulated babysitters.
I have seen the light. Thanks Frank, Delphi, Triston and others. You guys are patriots.
Matt K — August 13, 2009
Delicious sockpuppets, you must try some.
Frank Johnson — August 14, 2009
Americorps, you and I have had some words in the past and will probably have some more in the future (although I hope not), but your post convinced me that you are also a Patriot who (like me and the others you mentioned) trully love our country and what it stands for - which is freedom. Freedom to marry whom you wish. Civil liberties. Freedom of speech. Freedom of communication. Freedom to contact who you wish, even if it is a single foreign woman. Freedom (1) not to be treated like a criminal just because 2 morons were and (2) freedom to contact a foreign woman regardless if some feminists call them “prostitutes escaping desperate circumstances” or “uneducated, helpless, ignorant non-English speaking women who don’t know any better and need taxpayer funded feminist “protection.”
Freedom, if you are a man, to place your information with an International Friendship Service or Penpal Club (NOT the Layli Miller-Muro fabricated label of International Marriage Broker Service of which NONE exist.)
Freedom, if you are a foreign woman, to do the same. (NOT “mail order bride” another feminist propaganda label.)
There is a certain segment (probably 1 per cent) of "old fashioned" American men who are attracted to foreign women for various reasons, including physical looks, culture, traditional values, religious values, desire to raise a family, etc. These men are honest, hard working and appreciate an honest, mutual loving relationship based on mutual love and respect for each other. They are policemen, firemen, lawyers, doctors, actors, musicians, salesmen, truck drivers, clergymen, investors, etc. etc., you name it. They come from all walks of life, but they are GOOD honest men. They are decent men. They deserve that special someone on their lives. So what if that someone is from a different country? So what if that someone is from a different nationality? Who has the right to say they can't seek that special someone in their life?
There is a certain segment (probably 1 per cent) of "old fashioned" foreign women who are attracted to foreign men for various reasons, including physical looks, culture, traditional values, religious values, desire to raise a family, etc. These women are honest, hard working and appreciate an honest, mutual loving relationship based on mutual love and respect for each other. They are secretaries, nurses, salesladies, lawyers, business owners, teachers, college students, professors, etc. etc., you name it. They come from all walks of life, but they are GOOD honest women. They are decent women. They deserve that special someone on their lives. So what if that someone is from a different country (the USA.) So what if that someone is from a different nationality? Who has the right to say they can't seek that special someone in their life?
Folks, these are really decent, honest, law-abiding, God-fearing NICE people. DECENT men and women who just want the chance to be able to say hi to each other and take it from there. They are not stupid. They are not dumb. They will not just jump into the first thing that comes their way. They will test the waters. They will correspond with several people or whatever until they find what they feel could potentially be someone they feel compatible with. They correspond with emails and letters, exchange photos, reveal their innermost thoughts and feelings to the other person. Time passes until there comes a point where the man will take the voyage of a lifetime to meet that special someone he has been opening his heart to for the past year or so (or?)
The best part is when they finally meet in person, it will just be the “frosting on the cake” because they already know each other deep inside at that point in time. These marriages have a success rate in the high 90 per cent range and it is easy to see why.
But how do they “meet” in the first place? The normal term is services called International Friendship Services, Penpal Clubs (for single adults instead of school children), perhaps International Dating Services (although in my humble opinion “dating” means meeting for a date, going to dinner and then a movie or concert or something fun that both the lady and man finds enjoyable. Hard to do that when you are thousands of miles away.)
So how do they meet then?
First of all, the lady has usually heard of the PenPal Club (MY preferred term) through word of mouth from a happily married girlfriend, sister, cousin or business card (one service has over 1 million floating out there that the ladies photocopy and distribute to friends – sorry Layli).
Then the lady sends in her photo (conservative, of course, NO nudity, NO bikinis, face shots or full length photos in a conservative ankle or knee length dress.) The Penpal Service suggests a face shot because if you truly love someone and marry them, you had better love her face because hopefully you will be looking at it for the rest of your life.
Then the men. Same for them. A conservative photo, a lot of guys wear suits and get professional photos taken or maybe a shot of them in a favorite activity – tennis, golf, fishing, whatever. They are VERY serious about this.
Then the biodatas. Pretty much the same for both the men and women. Interests, hobbies, religious beliefs and practices, type of music they enjoy, what they like to read, what kind of movies they like, what kind of partner in life they hope to find. Typical, yet such very important stuff really.
Then the LADIES go over the men’s information and decide FOR THEMSELVES if any men interest them and who THEY will choose to respond to. In the cases where the men contact the ladies first, it is still THE LADIES who decide whom THEY wish to respond back to. Remember that. It is THE LADIES who do the choosing and picking!
Reiterate! THE LADIES ARE THE ONES WHO DO THE PICKING AND CHOOSING. And take my word for it, they are smart enough to know what they are doing and especially, the type of man they are looking for.
Then you have people like IRANIAN-american Layli Miller-Muro who knows NOTHING about these services (while claiming to be an “expert”), or the men who use these services and certainly not the ladies who use these services, let alone knowing how their relationships grow or what happens after they are married. She knows NOTHING NOTHING NOTHING and cannot come up with one bonifide and verified shred of evidence to prove that she does besides fabricated “facts and stats” out of her huge IRANIAN ass! Hey, when the couples are corresponding and growing their relationship, they don’t tell the Penpal Service about it, so how in the Hell would Layli know? After the couples have married and have kids, the only way the Penpal Service knows is when the happy couple sends them a photo and thank you letter, so how in the Hell would Layli know? These couples have no idea who in the Hell Layli Miller-Muro is, so how in the Hell does Layli Miller-Miller know what is going on and why does she LIE to make it sound like the husbands are (1) beating the crap out of their wives, (2) “premeditating torturing” them (Layli’s own words), (3) “serial abusing them” (Layli’s words), or (are you ready for this?) (4) “selling their wives to brothels!” Puuuleeeez! Give me a break! She must deal with some pretty stupid people to think she can get away with this crap!
Can you believe the media and politicians actually fall for this garbage? And she gets $1.5 million of our hard-earned tax dollars a year (and growing) to promote this BS?
Shame on her! Shame on Wash, DC for feeding her hate! Shame on the media for falling for it! Shame on the politicians for, wait, we already know they have no shame and certainly neither does she!
Delphi_Programmer — August 15, 2009
I absolutely agree with these last two posts. You see, Matt, Jeana (or whatever your name is) and all the rest of you, there are more than one or two of us out there. The messages from the few people here, who have been around the Internet, are just the tip of the iceberg. We are all over the place and come from all walks of life, as Frank reiterated above.
What's ironic about this whole thing is that real pornography, sex hookup and sham dating sites, like "prison penpals" and others, where women pose nude and ask for money, are under little or no attack.
It is the serious "personals ad" services (the term I like to use), where people seeking a life partner to build a family with, that are the subject of public scrutiny and dissent.
I call them personals ad services because that's what they are. They are no different than your local newspaper or magazine personals where people post and answer messages. The same information gets exchanged, the same type of meetings occur (except that foreign families are far more strict about dating protocol, so those women are actually SAFER than the local girls who meet through the Washington Post personals), and probably the same percentage of people eventually get married.
People who paint these services as "mail order bride" services are under the mistaken impression that only women advertise and hence are treated as "product". However, if they looked further they would find that similar pages of men's listings are sent to ladies. Are we also being "sold" to them as "product"? Where are we never referred to as "mail order grooms"?
These services comprise people freely posting and answering messages in what others have called a "free-will meeting place". It is people CHOOSING whom to contact and befriend; just like on Facebook, Friendster, MySpace, Match.com, Cupid's Destiny, the Sheela Wood column and a host of other similar services from the present and past. In fact, people in this country have been meeting marriage partners through personals advertising since the early 19th century. Only in the last three decades have these types of meetings been painted as exploitative, abusive, "trafficking", "modern-day slavery", "bride purchasing" and "servitude"; and the people referred to by the pejorative "mail order brides" and "consumer-husbands". All of this slander and defamatory hyperbole started right around the time the radical wing of the feminist movement got off the ground in the late 1960's; which, incidentally, is about the time "Women's and Gender Studies" curricula started being taught in colleges and universities. Interesting.....
When you get right down to it, free adults in a free society have the right to seek their own companionship however and wherever they find it. If two people choose to gamble on the motives of someone from a far away land, a very different culture and economy, or a much older or younger companion, it is BETWEEN THE TWO OF THEM. It is NONE of anybody else's business. If someone does abuse someone, it's up to law enforcement and the criminal justice system to deal individually with these people. It's not the government's role to be "Dr. Phil" and determine a safe family arrangement for every person.
Individual liberty and personal responsibility go hand in hand. These are the values the Founding Fathers had in mind when they wrote the Constitution. Are we going to hold fast to these ideals, or abandon them for a nanny police state?
Annie — August 23, 2009
Delphi, why are you so hung up on age? Yeah I'm in my twenties and sure wouldn't date someone over 30. But why would you want to date someone in her 20s when that's not your age group? I go for twenty-something guys, not for teenagers...
Frank Johnson — August 23, 2009
So when was there a law passed by angry bitter feminists about "age group" restriction?
It appears though that women do not have to follow this law. Hey Ann, what is a "cougar?" Why do you say "You go girl" everytime you see an old woman with a much younger man? No hypocrisy there! When you are an old angry bitter divorced woman, let us see how many dates you turn down just because the hot guy is way younger than yourself. And you WILL be old before you know it!
Another reason why foreign women are so superior to American women and why international marriages have a success rate in the high 90 per cent range as opposed to the 50 per cent failure (divorce) rate domestic marriages have.
Even if I was 20 years old, I would never marry an immature, childish, self centered American woman. They don't know what they want until they are at least 25 and then after that they change their minds every 6 months.They figure if the marriage doesn't work out they will just divorce the guy in 6 months and soak him for every cent they can.
Foreign women are so much more mature emotionally. Even at the age of 18, they know exactly what they want in a man. Oh yes, they associate age with wisdom and stability, not to mention much hotter sex!
Delphi_Programmer — August 25, 2009
Ummm Ann.
Did you even bother to read my latest post? I re-read it just now, and it only BRIEFLY mentions age as one item in a list at the very end, and the post ITSELF has absolutely NOTHING to do with age. So, if that's what you read into it, then you are obviously the one obsessed with age.
I advocate people's freedom to seek whatever they want within the law, which is more than can be said for you. Whether someone wants to date/marry someone their age, older or younger, and their reasons why, are THEIR OWN BUSINESS and NONE OF YOURS.
Matt K — August 25, 2009
Dang, you nailed it. I'm a woman. Not only that, but I'm a fat, man-hating lesbian! Gosh, you're just too darn smart.
Matt K — August 25, 2009
P.S. To anyone with moderating ability out there, I suggest closing comments for this post. I see no real reason to leave a post open when the only comments it's getting are so toxic. Plus, it's clogging up the "recent comments" sidebar with trash.
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heari — December 30, 2013
i am looking for true 45 65 old women ,sirious love an any rilationsip,
heari — December 30, 2013
srilove17@yahoo.com.
AntiMisandry — January 17, 2014
LOL, the funny thing is - those ads were google supplied. As you surely know the admins of the site have zero control over what ads appear, aside from blocking a few website promotions. Google ads are served to individuals via cookies & other tracking mechanisms laid out by Google itself.
This means that if a specific individual frequently looks up asian dating sites, they'll see adverts for dating sites that specialize in asians and the like.
So in short, that you were served those ads speaks volumes about YOUR personal google history - and nothing about AM as a website :)
toodles