Interesting post. I like to think of these as "shadow economies," which is firmly in the domain of economic sociology's view of understanding how social actors engage in economic activity.

Granovetter's 1985 article on embeddedness explains how workers and managers circumvent "the rules" in the name of instrumentalism and agency. I think when firms and organizations engage in similar activities, but I think the "moral outrage" is a function of who is doing the transgression in terms of power & resources.

Up here in Canada, small convenience store owners (often run by immigrants) in the GTA (Greater Toronto area) charge provincial and federal sales tax (13% in Ontario), but don't ring it up on the registers. Why do people tend to turn a blind eye? Laziness? A perception of a lack of "harm" (which probably adds up to a tidy sum rather quickly)?

Underground economies are beneficial for low-income people, especially if they aren't documented citizens. Back home, I found out the woman who has been cleaning my grandmothers house for years is in fact staying in the states illegally. This is extremely common because illegal immigrants are less expensive than documented, taxed workers, not to mention it is becoming increasingly popular to have consistent domestic service.

"Illegals account for around 5% of the labor force and just 2% of the wages paid in the US."

"one segment of illegals, the day labor sector, are in are an underground economy where the employers evade taxes and employment laws and the illegals evade taxes and another segment of illegals work for employers who do collect taxes and sometimes keep the tax money because the IRS and SSA cannot reconcile the accounts."

http://economistsview.typepad.com/economistsview/2007/12/legal-versus-il.html

Even if it is the underground economy that allows low-income families to survive in our competitive society, it is unethical and unfair to the rest of the citizens who follow the rules in their society participation.

Underground economies is a very interesting topic. Most people will say that they are wrong and uneithical. But others will say that its the only way low income familys can put shelter over their heads and feed their familys. I have mixed feelings about these "shadow economies" Are they the best way to make extra money? probably not but these low income familys that resort to working as a machanic out of their back yard or drug deals what evr it my be can not live on these low paying jobs they are common with low income familys.
Its kind of funny now that i think about it i have been exposed to these underground economies all my life. I can remember my own family members took our car to a family friend and have him change the oil, rotate the tires, and so on. It was to expensive to take it to a mechanic and he needed the money. it seemed harmless nothing more then a friend helping out another friend. To me it wasent illegal or us trying to get over on the government it was nothing more then a friend helping with a service. Though most people see it as unfair and illegal It is unfair to moralize because unfourtunately it is the low income citizens that have to resort to this kind of activity. When it comes to supporting your family iam sure you would do what ever is need to support your loved ones. Iam not saying its right but the risk of disobeying society is well worth it if it puts food on the table and clothes on their backs.

Personally I believe underground economies are essential for less affluent areas, were it’s a struggle for families to get by every day. These areas already have negative things going against them. They are surrounded by less privileged people resulting in less income, making it harder to pay the bill and keeping the house for going into foreclosure. On the same note business owners are forced to engage in underground economies because it’s the only means of survival. In a way underground economies to me are unethical but people are forced to engage in them, to ensure a safe future for the time being. Until the government gives aid to these areas underground economies will continue to exist.

I believe that underground economies are necessary in certain communities. I believe that certain underground economies are unethical whereas some are necessary. They are very rare and only account for a small percentage of the income in America. Certain economies such as producing and selling drugs. It is unfair to moralize because the people that usually need to resort to this behavior are the lower income families. I have have no experience with this subject, but I know know that if i had to resort to underground economies to support my family, I would.

Underground economies are certainly illegal and they border on unethical, but I have a hard time faulting anyone who engages it. Priority #1 has to be sustaining your family and an underground economy is better than nothing. But, I hate when I hear people that engage the underground economy complain about other groups of people that are on the government dole. Isn't it a bad signal to send children that it's ok to break certain laws as long as we keep it in the family or in the neighborhood?

In my life i have seen and even exerienced some underground economic activities. One side of my family consists of nothing but drug addicts and dealers. Although i do not agree with what the family does, it is the only thing that can really support themselves and family. My cousins have grown up with drugs in the house, parents always going to jail and what not. By experiencing this lifestyle through their entire life, they have become used to it. With no support in the home for education or discipline, and living in very poor areas, it is very easy for my cousins to fall into the same behavior. Yes these underground economies are morally wrong, but at the same time they are feeding families and provide shelter. The only question that is hard to answer is trying to figure out underground activity is also an incentive to not try harder to achieve a better life because it will always be there.

Morally, doing and paying for jobs "off the books" is a reasonable way to earn money because although it it not recorded the money is being earned legitimately through providing a service, but legally it is a crime because these may be large amounts that are going unrecorded. In my own home, my dad has hired professional workers who are friends to do jobs on the house "on the side" because the fee is is lower than going through the process the right way, through the company and paying for a rate rather than the job directly to the worker. I have a friend who came to the U.S illegally and works 5 days a week at a home day care in order to support her 2 kids in Mexico and on the weekends she cleans a house in Thousand Oaks and works at the swapmeet. She is earning a living for herself and her kids with hard work although she is not paying taxes, but she is not making the salaries that many Americans are making to live comfortably. She is earning her money with labor rather than selling drugs. In my opinion it depends on what is being done to earn the money. As long as there is no harm in what is being done then it should be left alone. I suppose no one is being physically or mentally hurt, but Americans are financially burdened because they have to pay the share of taxes these people are not paying. But they are ultimately providing a good service to society by doing the work that needs to be done although they are doing it for lower wages than the rest of America.

Underground economies are a necessary component for some people and communities. Low-income families don't have the necessary education or skills needed for the high paying jobs. So they must resort to other ways of income like drug dealing. I know some people who didn't grow up in a well disciplined home which resulted in them getting in trouble and going to jail. Once you have a felony on your record it is really hard to get a jail so they had to find others ways to support themselves and that was selling drugs. It may not be ethical but its helping them survive.
Underground economies are inevitable especially now since the economy is going through a recession and many people are losing their jobs. People will do whatever is necessary for the protection and well-being of their families and themselves.

I personally think that underground economies are inevitable. People need to provide for their families, and sometimes this is the only way. I don't agree with it, but if thats how some people have to get by. Where I live, this doesn't happen as much. Even the school I went to was really nice, but some kids always ended up getting into trouble. Even my two close friends in high school were expelled for drugs. Wealthy people are getting into trouble with drugs, when there are people out there trying to make a living off of it. To me it is unethical because I didn't grow up in an area where it was a normal thing. However, to some people, this is their life.

These underground societies are just another form of business. There are times and certain situations where people are corrupt and violence may occur, no different from ENRON or any other US company that takes advantage of the system, but in the overall picture i feel besides ducking taxes or finding ways to survive there is nothing illegitimate about what these underground societies do to make a living. I know that taxes are overrated, yet they run the country, but the only problem i see with these underground businesses is that most of the rest of the country has to pay their dues even when they may be struggling and these people dont. Now the world is not fair, so this is either due to the ones paying taxes and struggling for rent are not utilizing their minds and resources like these underground societies are or there is moral issue that takes a bigger effect. We have no right to judge these societies for wrong doing, for EVERYONE thinks of the betterment of themselves or their close ones, especially when it comes to survival. Their has been a time where all of us have committed some form of immoral act, and thus have no spot to judge. Ethics comes from philosophy and religion and is an important quota in society, but who are we to say its unethical. I think this ties closely with the moral dilemma. But from what we are taught, these acts would be considered unethical, though i feel that there are times when you can throw away the book and it is still the right thing to do. In closing, i have not experienced first hand these situations in my neighborhood, but am from Chicago and have been to the south side too many times for a "northsider" and could confidently say that all in all these supposedly illegitimate businesses go hand in hand with the ones above ground. survival and becoming someone is the "American Dream" and people go for it.

I found Venkatesh's article to be extremely intriguing, in terms of the underground economies in the South Side of Chicago. It appeared that these economies weren't even really "shady" business. They were a part of every day life that nearly every citizen, upstanding or not, had some involvement in. Police officers and law enforcement officials are not only aware of these practices, but they also participate in many. These underground economies are not only common, but seem to be an essential part of life in this neighborhood and others like it. They're a part of what makes life function and makes earning a livelihood possible. I know for a fact that underground economies exist nearly everywhere, and although they might not have anything to do with being necessary for making enough money to feed your family, it's undeniable that they are there. They existed in my upper middle class suburban neighborhood outside of Denver and I have no doubt they exist even here, in Thousand Oaks (the second safest city in America).

These underground economies that exist across America do so for a number of reasons. I'm sure that in areas such as Miami and the South Side of Chicago it has much to do with the lack of trust in the rule of law. These areas are populated by minorities, who, for most of history in the U.S. have not had the law on their side. Even after discrimination legislation was outlawed, these groups still were discriminated against in terms of opportunity. It's no wonder they lack faith in there government and therefore turn to other means of obtaining success in the circumstances they face.

I think I can tolerate people with those underground jobs but I don't think that I can totally accept them. In Vietnam, where I grow up, that's how a lot of people earn their living. Renting off their house, illegally copying DVDs, selling mass-production food without inspection...the list is very long. Those people are my friends' parents and my father also used to work for those kinds of companies.
Sometimes I think that it is kind of unfair for other people that work legally and pay taxes and all that, but I have to admit that it is hard to resist the temptation to buy the cheap products from those "companies". Still, I wouldn't make a choice of earning my living like that.
The thing that aggravates me, though, is that some poor folks cannot afford the "real" stuff like real food or real TV from good brands, they purchase things from those places and they get sick or the TV suddenly exploded or something like that. I heard stories of cheap mugs that cannot hold hot water and the people carrying it got burn.
Anyway, ideally and hopefully, all that can end sometimes and people can live equally. But like racism and prejudice and all that, I am afraid there will be no end to the situation (that's why capitalism persists and communism perished).

It is very understandable why there are underground economies within communities such as south chicago and miami. It is a group of people who understand and are from similar situations who are not trying to cheat the government but trying to get by with using minor illegal scenarios. It is unethical in the sense that they are cheating the government and other people who go about the legal way and do pay for the added on property or business are being semi cheated but those people are also in much different situations economically.

Underground economies is understandable just because where i am from i see it everyday. I mean, underground economies can be seen in every country even the wealthiest and most ethical one. At some point, underground economy was "practiced". I think that as long as the people concerned are not going beyond the acceptable case of underground economies then we should not worry. People use underground economies out of despair and out of needs. They have to survive and they have families to feed and if their survival depends on altering the laws, breaking them or trying their best to suit the law according to them, then who are we to judge to them? I am sure that at some point in our lives, we have or we will be part of this group. And even if its not from our own experience, we have seen it through our relatives or people we know. Not everyone is born with a golden spoon in their mouth, they have learned the hard way and made sacrifices to survive. No one wants to break laws. I think it is unethical but it depends on the cases. Some people are not willing to go with underground economies but still do while some others have the choice but still go for underground economies.

People are always going to do what they need to do to make a better living for themselves, regardless of whether it is right or wrong. Some people don't have as many opportunities, so they are forced to do anything and everything just to get by. It seems wrong and illegal to participate in things such as efficiency apartments, but at the same time, sometimes this is all these types of people have to make a source of income for themselves. It is wrong to go against the government, but people are always going to do it because sometimes there are just no other opportunities.

Though doing things like the ones described above might seem and rationally in fact are shady and in many cases illegal, i do not think someone who has not been faced or is not familiar with situations in which desperation for income or simply need for a better economical status actually made these "off the books" strategies seem like an option can fully understand why people sometimes commit these acts. it is easy to judge when looking from the outside, but one should always try to see things from others' perspective. in my personal opinion acts like these should not take place because they undermine the sovereignty of the government and figures of authority and also deprive the state from income, but i understand that for some this is the only way to make a living

Underground economies is a part of a negative cycle. Illegal businesses and property expansion leads to gvmt's loss of tax money and unsafe and unstable housing situations. This causes even an even less fortunate situation for these communities. Yet it is difficult to break this cycle, mostly because the people engaging in this underground economy often does not have a choice due to unemployment, illegal immigration etc.

The underground economy is also often tightly linked to legal businesses which makes it easier to cover up. in my opinion think we need to focus first on the "under-the-table market" and insider trading and Wall street before we knock down on these communities.

There are of course exceptions, when immediate action needs to be taken. Especially when the underground economy is based on illegal businesses severely violating the law such as dog fighting and drug dealing.

What do you think about underground economies. Are the things I described unethical? Are we in a position to moralize? Does any of this mirror your own experiences?

These UNDERGROUND ECONOMIES are by law illegal. But i feel that there is nothing ethical wrong with this. Its just people trying to get there money anyway they can in a society that they are on the bottom of the food chain. If any person was put in the same sitution were the only money they can make was with these under ground economies. These economies help supply this lower community jus enough for them to make a living. Immigrants especially benefit from these.

we have no right to say these things are immoral or wrong. Everyone should be able to make a living and if they cant this is a way for them to be able too. I have seen it all from Drug dealers on the corner to little old abuelas sealing the things they make. all they are doing is trying to make a decent life becasue the are at an unfair situation in life

I think underground economies have their plus factors and their minus too. They are often necessary for survival as we see in many countries around the world who still practice bartering. Many of these countries have peoples with low incomes who barter their goods to barely get by. Many of these countries are successful and peaceful countries who have market economies that are taxed and these underground bartering economies. There are people in America who need to barter their goods to survive and can't even afford the taxes. I know that everyone needs to follow the law but we have survived as a nation so far the way we have with our economy and then underground economies so I don't think we need to work against these underground economies. They still contribute to the greater economy of our nation. Breaking the law is immoral but I feel that if it is breaking a minor law like not paying taxes, so one can survive, it is acceptable.

Underground economies are completely understandable. People do what they have to do in order to survive with the lowest of what is available. I know and I see these underground economies working everyday, and it is necessary for some family's just so they can put food on the table for their family that night. Most people are cornered and forced to survive through the underground economies because they are unable to get a stable job that pays well enough.
I do think that what you described is unethical. I think underground economies are unethical, but as I said before, people have to do what it takes, so although it is unethical, it is understandable. I don't think that anyone is in a position to moralize anyone or anything that one person chooses. No one will ever fully understand what another family is going through and so there is no need to moralize. I am lucky to say that this does not mirror any of my experiences or anything that I have been through, but I have seen family members struggle and experience life through the underground economy.

Underground economies are the methods that the people who use them see as the best option to survive in modern society. Although many people may see what they are doing as unethical and problematic I feel that they found a niche in society that they are able to use to their advantage, and I applaud them for finding it. The economies might not be completely ethical, but morality should be determined by each individual person, not by a religion or a government. Personally I bet that if given the chance almost anybody would throw ethics to the wind and allow one of their friends to write them a false claim for their house or car. The people who are adding onto their house without a permit are just sidestepping the government, they do not want to have to wait months on end to get a permit to do some minor housework, and they know people around the neighborhood who can help them do the work. These people, are not evil, they are good people, and they found a loophole in the system, I find no reason to punish them for using it to their advantage. In my personal experiences I have only one example that somewhat correlates, when I was younger there were some men working on the tv, phone, etc. lines outside of my house, somehow during the time that they were working they did something and instead of having the local channels (as we did before) we had a full range of channels, that I am quite sure we were not paying for. Other than that, helping friends *check* his answers on homework all throughout high school is the closest that I can relate, the teachers may have been mad if they found out, but we did what we had to in order to make it through all the busy work that the teachers assigned to us.

Underground economies are not just illegal, they are unfair to those who do pay their taxes. Nobody likes to pay taxes, but we all do and that money goes to things such as public schools, healthcare and defense. Avoiding these taxes causes the rest of the people to pay more because the government is always going to get their money. That being said, it is completely understandable for people to do what they need to do to survive and if that means creating these underground economies than that is a problem we need to fix by cutting spending so people don't have to be taxed as much. My personal feeling is that if you live in this country and want the benefits of living here, then you should also follow the rules of this country, but human nature is always going to be do what you need to survive.

Underground economies are without a doubt illegal. However, I am not in a position to condone what people do in order to survive. I can not 100% for sure say that if I was in their positions that I would not turn to underground ways of making money. To answer the question, I do think that underground economies are unethical but I do not think that all of the people who take part in them are bad people. I think it is a mix, some people do it because they have tried every other way to make money and some people are just plain lazy and look for an easy way to make cash.

In ways, I do believe that underground economies are unethical, however, this position and other positions such as this could be due to the fact that we are taught what is morally correct and incorrect within society. However, I also do believe that it is all right for people to engage in the underground economy when it comes down to supporting a family and trying to survive in this world. But then I am also confronted with the problem that if it is ok to engage in these activities because of the reason I have asserted above, then what would be the motivation to not engage in this activity once you feel as though you can do without it? It is hard for me to be in a judging position as to whether or not these things are morally correct or incorrect when I am not omniscient and do not know what is truly right from wrong other than what I have been taught. But I do believe that it is important not to inform your children on your engagements in the underground economy or involve them in it. I personally do not have any experiences from family or friends involved in the shadow economy.

The logic behind underground economies is completely rational. People who are at the bottom rung of the ladder oftentimes have nowhere to turn but to shady deals, and “off the books” businesses. While some might have the best intentions selling licit materials to their neighbors and friends, there are those out there who do not have these sincere interests at heart. Regardless of this, I feel that it is unethical to engage in an underground economy. It’s easy for me to say this because I am not in their situation; if I were, I don’t know what I would do. I think I would have the moral fortitude to not engage in underground economies because in the long run, it seems to hurt everyone.

I think that underground economics is essential to how America and the whole world works whether we like it or not. I don't entirely agree with it but i know it happens and there's not much i or anyone can do about it. People will make up there own minds when it comes to this kind of situation. The fact that this happens doesn't make it a bad thing it could be a very good source of income to some people like he said in his blog. But at the same time it hurts the actual economy some, though i don't think it affects it to a major degree to where it can be extremely harmful. I my self have not experienced to much of this but i don't think that its should be looked down upon depending on the seriousness of the situation.

I can understand why underground economies may be necessary in certain communities and neighborhoods. Often times the lower income families have no other choice, so this kind of economy is realistic and seems the most common sense, regardless of whether it is ethical or not. It may be different if I had personally experienced this kind of lifestyle or lived in a society where this was prevalent, but being that I did not, it is a little more difficult for me to relate to. In my opinion, if you are living in America, you need to be completely American. Whether you trust the government or not, you need to learn to. It is unfair for those of us who have to pay taxes and every other charge the government lays on us. Just because we follow the rules does not necessarily mean we trust the government either, but it is the right thing to do.

I feel as though this will always take place, whether people are short of money and are forced to take such actions or if that person just loves a deal and likes to "beat the system". I think that people work with what they have if they trade this for that and it works for them it will continue to take place.

I was watching a History channel program entitled "Gangland" and one particular episode focused on the gang known as "The Latin Kings." Based primarily in the Southside of Chicago, what was unusual about this particular gang was they not only allowed their gang members to have legitimate jobs and businesses, but they encouraged it. Most of the gang members hail this phenomenon as one of its kind among gang culture. While most gangs want to focus their members on illicit activities only, the Latin Kings and their guidelines for their members were only focused on their members getting rich and moving up the economic hierarchy. As a result, many of these gang members were legal business owners and operators by day and gang members by night.

Looking at the situation critically, it is hard to ignore the illicit activities and the wealth that can be made from them, especially in inner cities where jobs are scarce and unemployment is high. While I certainly don't condone murder and other such destructive acts of violence towards other citizens by gangs, I do understand why these members turn to other, more lucrative options. However, there is a fine line between the two.

Ideally, it would be great if all neighborhoods would abide by the same laws and regulations, but I don't see the immense harm in certain activities such as running businesses out of our house, adding rooms to rent out to others and other such minor indiscretions. I believe that if these certain behaviors are accepted by the community as a whole, that they should not be regulated or monitored as tightly. In the southside of Chicago, I think many of these activities wouldn't be shunned upon and thus should be allowed because the thought is that some of these neighborhoods could indeed pull themselves out of poverty through such means.

Well I was born in raised in the San Fernando Valley so we had a somewhat underground economy. But for the most part the underground economy was pretty overt. On any Saturday morning you can go to any intersection in Sylmar and find fresh flowers of fruit for sale. You go to any gas station and you can find the man who sell “Chi-Cha-roon” (they are like pork rinds) or buy a fruit bowl with lime and salt on it. If anything happens to your car everyone has a friend who has a friend who can “hook you up” who does a GREAT job for less than half the price. I enjoy having these services. I can understand why they are illegal but for me it is a lot more convenient and makes life a lot more interesting.

This is a very tough subject to tackle. Of course its wrong to do illegal things - but sometimes its the only road people can take. I mean what would you do when your family is hanging in the balance. Some people honestly dont have the opportunities to go back to school - or to get a different job. Some people make mistakes and get jail time - or small crimes- that make it so people dont want to hire you - even if your all cleaned up. Some people have to make it one way or another - even if it is wrong. I mean thousands of people are doing illegal things everyday, you going to stop the drugs being sold - and the under the table actions - you cant. Quoting Fight Club.... "Look, the people you are after are the people you depend on. We cook your meals, we haul your trash, we connect your calls, we drive your ambulances. We guard you while you sleep. Do not... F___ with us." Although different contexts - it can relate - cause some of these people are exactly that.

While underground communities are illegal, I cannot say I fault anyone who chooses to engage in them. To answer questions like this, I like to put myself in the shoes of someone in that situation. If engaging in an underground community meant being able to put food on the table for my family, I cannot say that I would not seriously consider it. Granted that it is unlawful, I still am not convinced that you could tab it as unlawful. I mean these are poor people living in poor neighborhoods with no means of getting ahead. So if having a day job and also making a little money through an undergound community, I do not see that as unethical.

The underground economy is very common with minorities, especially the undocumented. I personally don’t see anything wrong with it. But that might be perhaps because I have known people that have done that and are still doing it. That in return might have caused an impact on my point of view on this topic. I believe a job is defined as someone working hard, like labor work and in return getting money for the services they provided. The underground economy occurs because people need to make a living one way or another. Especially the undocumented that aren’t provided with the same resources a U.S citizen would have. As a result they come up with other resources, this being the underground economy. This isn’t harming anyone at all, it is only causing people to get upset because they aren’t paying taxes. But that is just one of the risks that they face in being a part of the underground economy.

I do not think that these types of underground economy are unethical (minus drug dealing, prostitution, extortion, etc..). Yes, they are technically illegal, with regards to tax evasion and what not, but it is just another way to exchange money for services. Off the books income is not only found in low income neighborhoods, or inner city environments, it can be found out here in Thousand Oaks as well. I used to work at an electronics store out here in TO. I made friends with many of the guys who did car install on the equipment we sold. As an employee at this store, I knew how ridiculous the markup was on installations. On several occasions, I would have the guys in the install shop do work for me on my car for what was considered pennies to the outrageous costs the store set; even under our employee discounts. None of the guys needed the money, I guess it was just nice to have some extra income on the side. Regardless of what environment you live in, if you can make money on the side doing what you do best, you are probably going to take that opportunity. Although these guys could have possibly lost their jobs over a few bucks, I don't they lost any sleep over their "unethical" decision to "help me help them." If local law enforcement don't see any immediate problems with what you do "off the books," I doubt there is any ethical problem with your practices.

While underground economies are illegal, they can be justified. People are going to do what they can in order to get by in life, even if that means breaking the law. This is especially true in low income neighborhoods where the majority of illegal activity occurs. However, I don't believe that the people who participate in these underground economies are blatantly ignoring the law in opposition to authority. Instead they are participating in these acts as a means of survival. As a result, you can't necessarily label them as "bad." You have to consider that these people are placed in sketchy situations with limited options. I know that if I were in a position where I would have to resort to shady business practices, I would consider it. It's definitely not fair or the right thing to do, but if that was my last resort, I would have to take it into consideration.

I have basically grown up with 'underground economy'. where everything is cheap. I think that these things are able to be justified. They are just people that might have a problem with the system or have chosen what they do for other legitimate reasons and I see no problem with that. It might be considered shady or sketchy to some, but it's' a way to get by. In China, there are counterfeit and illegal products everywhere. The dvds are mostly pirated, along with cds and such. The good quality dvds are at most 20RMB, which is 3 dollars tops here. I don't see any unethical properties with that kind of business, although I could understand that others do.

I think we live in a society that is similar to survival of the fittest and these people that are creating these underground economies are just doing what they have to do to get food on the table and and clothes on their backs. So might do these things to provide for their children and put them through school so they can grow up and be successful with their lives. I don't think those things are unethical because I think anyone would do it to get more money to provide for their family's. If someone wants or needs something they will most like get it no matter what they have to do legal or illegal it doesn't matter, this is not a very good example but when i was little probably 4 or 5 years old I really wanted a toy from the store and my mom would not buy it for me but I wanted it so bad I took it but yeah pretty much people will get what they need to survive no matter what.

I do not think that underground economies are 'good' necessarily, but I don't think that I have a right to moralize it. We are not in the position to moralize underground economies because the motives behind various underground businesses are very different. People that are of a lower income class often resort to underground economies because it provides them with an immediate fix to their financial problems. It is understandable that people would resort to underground businesses if that is their main, consistent source of income. I can understand that being economically strained can cause people to partake in illicit behavior. I believe that if I was placed in a situation where the underground economy was my only source of monetary gain, I would consider partaking in it. These underground businesses are not immoral because, normally, the people partaking in them are not doing it solely to defy authority. They are engaging in illicit behavior as a means of survival. I do not think that we have the right to label these actions as 'immoral' because we cannot fully understand individual's motives and circumstances.

If you look at underground economies, you'll realize that it really is sometimes the best and smartest thing to get involved in. Some people need the help of the underground economy so they can have cheep goods and cheep labor. Others work the underground economy to make a considerable profit. But even if their profit is unfair, I doubt the people who are getting such great deals mind.
I dont think anyone is in a position to moralize at all. Everyone looks out for their own best interest, no one is a positions to judge. Especially people who feel no qualms about buying the goods off the street when they're on vacation or shopping in New York City or in LA's Garment District.
I havent had much experience with the underground economy aside from "bargain hunting" in big cities and other countries. But I can certainly understand the mentality of those who use the underground economy. Its a smart business move for many people.

Underground economies are simply the reflection of the de jure economy not serving the peoples in these lower-class situations. The implicit exploitation of these people, whether they are urban blacks, immigrant Latinos, or another group that is prone to lesser socioeconomic standing, through the current system is reciprocated back at the legitimized market system by secondary markets that bypass legal establishment. If the law already doesn't support these individuals very much, or they feel that it doesn't support them very, then they will go to an alternate economic and legal system that better represents themselves. The situation reminds me of the accepted custom of black workers stealing from their employers during the era of Segregation. These modern "under-the-radar markets" are doing those same kinds of things, but no matter the profits they turn out they are still in a form of social bondage to mainstream society and its law system.

Well underground economies, evetually get back to the legal market, because not all goods from the community are purchased in the same, some of the stuff has to be actually acquired legally, so its not all bad. Plus everyone to one point makes use of it for its convinience and price. For instance babysitters. And also sometimes those economies might start of as underground, but eventually make their way into the legal market, i know for instance that latinos may start their business that way in order to get started but eventually they always want to have their shop, market, company..etc. So its more like an opportunity to eventually get to greater and better things. so I dont believe its all bad

Undergroud economies prove to be a touchy subject. People who are not part of these underground economies are more likely to view them as unethical because it is a way of "cheating the system." Those people need to look at the subject from the opposite perspective before they should make that type of judgment. What if it was them in that low income situation, would they engage in the activities of an underground economy? My guess is "yes." This is because those who are part of the underground economy only see it as a way of surviving. It very well may be the only option they have to make sure their families are fed and taken care of. I personally cannot recall any of my own experiences on the matter of underground economies, but I'm sure if I was in the situation where an underground economy was my only option, I would participate.

I think that underground economies are a way of survival for those who are under privileged or poorer than most, mainly minorities in this case. I myself have not been someone who has used an underground economy as a means of survival but have seen, witnessed, and experienced people who have. My cousins who stay in south central in between vernon and normandie have the "bootleg" cable where you can get free pay-per-view and unlimited channels for free. People who are under these circumstances cannot afford standard cable or the standard necessities that this society makes us believe that we need. So they attain these things by any means or ways necessary. I do no think that this can be moralized because as long as there is any type of socio-economic inequality, than there will continue to be underground economies.

Underground economies are happening all around us. They are illegal, but for many they are the only way they know how to live. When someone grows up with all their family and friends taking part of this type of business they might not even see how it is wrong at all. These types of businesses thrive in communities where poverty is high. Because the community members are often poor all they are trying to do is support their families and make ends meet. It is also competitive; if everyone around you is taking part and making more money than you it would be hard not to get involved in it.
It think these types of economies are going on all around us; people might even be unaware if their neighbors are involved. Personally I haven't witnessed this, but it probably was occurring right around me and i never saw it or even thought about it.

It is important for the country to have these sub economies. They increase cashflow and teach skills that can be with proper education used for the greater good.

I am kind of in the middle on underground economies. I definitely think it's illegal and probably unethical, but I also don't feel I am really in a position to moralize. I think it's hard to condone or justify it when you are looking from the outside or haven't lived in an area that really experienced that. However, people who grow up where underground economies are extremely normal and in a lot of ways, a means of survival, probably have an easier time understanding the necessity in having them and can even justify participating in it. I understand people partaking in it because they are in desperation or it is their only way to really bring in money for themselves or their family. I haven't been in a situation where I would have to even consider this as an option, but I imagine if my family was in dire need of money, I would probably be more willing to partake in that. I don't think it's really right for people to just do it to get cheaper services, etc. The underground economy is definitely mixed with people who have no other choice and with people who are just lazy and taking advantage of the system. I think it undermines the government and authority, but I also feel the underground economy is almost inevitable. People are going to use it as long as it's there..

This was a very interesting article to read about underground economies. I think that underground economies have been around forever and it was an essential way for people to live their lives to earn enough money for their family. In a lower class society, high paying jobs might be difficult to come by and that is why I think many people create and have businesses from their homes. This is a way for someone to support their family and try to survive in the tough economy. This is why I think that "Underground economies" exist such as creating businesses out of the home or "Hustling" as it said in the article. I found that the quote mentioned in the article was very interesting which said, "we cannot truly understand the “shady” economy if we see it as a dirty, lawless world of violence and disrepute, one that tarnishes an otherwise pristine sphere where everyone pays their taxes, obeys the laws, and turns to the government to solve disputes and maintain order." THis quote to be demonstrated the existence of "shady" economies and trying to get around the government.