Hope and Kristi P. sent in another example of the way the idea of a “curvy” shape is associated with non-White bodies. This Levi’s ad for their Curve ID jeans shows models whose skin color gets progressively darker as they move from less to more curvy styles:
Notice also that curvy here means primarily having a larger butt. All three models are show in size 27 jeans, which generally are equivalent to about a size 4 (though of course, sizes vary greatly) — certainly larger than the average runway model, but still very small.
Question: does anyone have examples of non-White men depicted as uniquely or systematically “curvy,” or is this applied only to women?
Comments 49
El Train — November 27, 2010
'Curviness' is considered feminine, so I seriously doubt it's ever been applied to men, period.
oliviacw — November 27, 2010
This is kind of funny, because with the original Levi's ads for the Curve ID jeans, they got a lot of criticism for using only white models (see http://www.thefrisky.com/post/246-levis-new-curve-id-jeans-proving-to-be-controversial/). The difference in "curviness" between the styles is also up for debate - the whole concept seems to be problematic for a lot of reasons.
j-p — November 27, 2010
Funny how the happiest on the ad seems to be the curviest.
forsythia — November 27, 2010
The big scary black guy seems to be a standard of social mythology.
Syd — November 27, 2010
'Curvy' is almost exclusively applied to women because it refers to body parts that are generally exclusive to female bodied people (particularly, an hourglass or pear-shaped figure with hips and butt very distinct from a smaller waist, and possibly large breasts. It's actually pretty annoying to constantly be barraged with the idea that curvy=plus-sized, and that everyone under a size 12 or 14 is a straight up-and-down column, which comes with the questioning of why all the models are roughly the same size. A size 4 models can indeed be 'curvy'). A man COULD have that shape, but it would be the exception. A woman being curvy, while not quite the rule, is quite common. Black and Latina women are often stereotyped as being curvy or having large butts/hips. Black and Latina men have a host of stereotypes applied to them, but none of them have to do with having large breasts or hips like women. Interestingly enough, people of color are not a monolith, particularly when we bring sex and gender into the equation (though sites like this are, typically, woefully lacking on that realization). Seriously, asking if non-white men are often stereotyped as 'curvy' is like asking if Asian men are sometimes stereotyped as having sideways vaginas because Asian women sometimes are.
Erika — November 27, 2010
I haven't seen black men portrayed as curvier per se.
However, "curves" are a secondary sex characteristic. Black women are portrayed as having "more" of that particular secondary sex characteristic.
Black men, on the other hand, are typically portrayed as having more of... let's just say, a different secondary sex characteristic.
So... kind of the same thing?
Erika — November 27, 2010
Oh, and I just realized that the stereotypical black man is portrayed as having a much lower voice. Which is also a secondary sex characteristic.
Tanglethis — November 27, 2010
Anecdata for your question about men: I went to a predominantly black high school in the 90s, and at that time "stout" was used as a complimentary term for both males and females* who had a substantial butt. "Thick" also was used admiringly for both genders, although that may have indicated carrying weight all over. In particularly I recall a girl complimenting my white boyfriend for being stout, as opposed to most white boys who were skinny.
*I actually hate using "male" and "female" as nouns for human beings (sounds like a nature show to me), but I balked at calling teenagers either "boys and girls" or "men and women."
Philip Harrover — November 27, 2010
One image does not a trend make. It is easy to read into any one thing all sorts of things. There are six possible orderings of the three models from left to right. If one were chosen randomly (at 0.17 probability each), couldn't some bias or stereotype be read into them too? And, is this the only ordering that has actually made it out for public consumption?
Nijuro — November 28, 2010
If women have curves then men have angles.
stack o'lee — November 28, 2010
Just as "nappy" as a descriptor for black hair assumed negative connotations because it is about black hair; "curvy" and other terms associated with the female body have become problematic when associated with the female body and color. Currently, the idealized female body is curvy; and real female bodies are more curvilinear than male bodies. As the idealized body image vacillates between stick thin and curvy, it is important to understand that size always matters. Whether Kate Moss thin or Kim Kardashian/J. Lo/Beyonce curvy, the female body must be small, and proportioned a certain way. (A large round stomach? No, not unless the woman is pregnant. No one seems to favor huge, round thighs, or full arms, or big calves!) Also, note the ethnicity and race of the aforementioned "curvy" media icons. It would be nice to pretend that "curvy" doesn't have a subtle racial/ethnic connotation. The Levi's ad unwittingly put that association right up front.
Kat — November 28, 2010
As olivia has already pointed out: Your analysis of this is OFF. The Black woman was included in the ads after Women of Color protested the first ads with only White models. The WoC protesters themselves stated explicitly that Latinas and Black women were more likely to have curvy bodies and thus should be represented as one of the main customers of these jeans.
So the company here seems to "overcompensate" -at most.
Amy — November 28, 2010
I dunno, I was mostly happy with this ad when I saw
1) women of varied ethnicities.
2) recognition that women can have different waist/hip ratios.
azizi — November 28, 2010
"Question: does anyone have examples of non-White men depicted as uniquely or systematically “curvy,” or is this applied only to women?"
-gwen
Gwen, I get why you addressed the subject of race (because the ad has the Black model as the so-called curvier woman). But I think the question "are non-White males considered curvy?" to be a bit of a stretch (if you'll pardon my use of the word "stretch" in the context of a discussion about properly sized jeans).
If you wanted to introduce the topic of male gender into this discussion, I find it interesting that you didn't ask is "curviness" considered a male attribute in the USA, and if not why not?
Also, as a friendly ammendment, I'd like to suggest the use of the more updated & more culturally competent referents "People of Color", "Men of Color" and "Women of Color" etc instead of "non-white".
Here's a Wikipedia excerpt about that referent:
"Person of color (plural: people of color; persons of color) is a term used, primarily in the United States, to describe all people who are not white. The term is meant to be inclusive among non-white groups, emphasizing common experiences of racism. People of color was introduced as a preferrable replacement to both non-white and minority, which are also inclusive, because it frames the subject positively; non-white defines people in terms of what they are not (white), and minority frequently carries a subordinate connotation."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Person_of_color
[I added the italics in that Wikipedia quote to highlight that sentence.]
Cute Bruiser — November 28, 2010
I think the black-male equivalent of the curvy stereotype is the stereotype that black men have, ahem, larger members. Surprised no one else has said that yet.
Anonymous — November 28, 2010
I think I recall a mention on Scrubs of Turk (who's black) having a nice butt, and making J.D. (white, and portrayed as kind of skinny and pathetic) jealous or something. J.D. may have had a sort of daydream sequence (something he does a lot, generally) about how life would be better if he had Turk's butt or something?
But maybe this is all just a weirdly elaborate thing I'm totally imagining I saw.
Erin — November 29, 2010
If you play around on the site some more, they have photos of women of all colors and sizes modeling all the fits of jeans. It's pretty neat. You pick your size and you can see a selection of women your size wearing them.
Baby Maker — November 29, 2010
You see, women have larger hips in order to aid them with child birth. It's an evolutionary thing and a gender thing. Men don't have as large of hips because they don't have babies.
Kesha — November 30, 2010
My anatomy book from freshmen year in college showed a white male and a black male side by side from the back to show how differently they are shaped. The black male was considered much more curvy, though of course the anatomy book didn't use that language.
Icon — December 2, 2010
"It indicates that gwen, a SOCIOLOGIST, is failing to realize that gender exists in nonwhite circles."
Unfortunately, I've seen this as well from Gwen and others. I think this screams of white female privilege, and being considered feminine, and then having a problem when other women are said to have feminine and attractive qualities (IE Ugh! Asian women are not more feminine! Many white women are thin!", and "White women have feminine curves too!"). Yeah, the majority of obese people in this country are white women, yet, I do not see white feminists en masse protesting the images of black women throughout pop-culture as fat and instead, saying all women in the US are fat and should be considered as such... This is NOT an issue for me of fat acceptance, but MANY aspects of this blog (such as the famous post that Men of color are less happy than women of color because of racial oppression) are through the gaze of white female privilege, liberal cognitive dissonance about intra-race brutal misogyny and hatred of black women, etc.,
Black women are considered curvy...but don't worry dear privileged (and insecure of losing privilege?) white females... America still views YOU as the standard. Our curves mean we're to be degraded, used and exploited for sex, groped etc., while you still the one who benefit from the "feminine", "marriagable", "for love" stereotypes globally...simply because you're white.
And that's all I have to say about that.
~Disgruntled
di — December 4, 2010
It's culture and money making man. Sucks but the shit sells.
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[...] Images http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2010/09/15/conflating-ethnic-and-curvy/ and http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2010/11/27/who-has-curves/) Another point, the FAs interviewed were thin, and attractive, as if to make them seem more more [...]
just some guy — March 15, 2011
If they had the models sorted in a different way that could be seen as racist (not hard to find some racists that would say that black women have no curves and such things), if the black girl was the first one, and sexist and racist, sexualizing the black woman as some sort of beast that with pure sex instincts, posing provocatively with her legs somewhat open and the face somewhat covered by the hair, symbolizing that she does not matter as a person, only her body as a thing.
I would like to see more examples or demonstrations of how come something couldn't be either racist or sexist when someone makes this sort of analysis. I bet that when someone does that, if you show the corrected version to a different potically-correct inclined person, this second person would still see something racist, sexist or both, or even more bad stuff of other sorts.
I'm not saying this sort of thing does not exist, but sometimes it may be just a "coincidence". People thinking that there's nothing insulting or sexist about a particular random assortment of skin shades and curvaceousness, for example. It never occurred to me.
King — March 14, 2012
Why do we have to say 'non-white?'
If we can refer to someone as being white then it must be perfectly ok to refer to someone as black.
Koldpurple — October 13, 2012
Those women all look the same skinny size to me. It is racial.
En6u3 — October 24, 2012
I'm a black woman, and I have the same impression at least when it comes to backsides. I do have a problem with the constant insistence that curvy means fat, and that fat is a minority thing, but when it comes to jeans, I wish I could show you how oblivious these designers are of my body type. Even jeans that they sell as curvy are a joke, and I say that as someone who is curvy and at her target weight. 5'11, 150, size 6. We are (many of us, anyway) definitely curvier in the backside, and if Levi's was anything close to serious about those "bold curves" (which I highly doubt), I, for one, would scream it from the mountain top.
Domestic Violence | Domestic Abuse Day 3: feminist slogans, actions, t-shirts - Domestic Violence | Domestic Abuse — August 25, 2014
[…] willingness to draw attention to ourselves likewise shape what we can wear. In the USA, even the curvy shapes of our clothes can have actually gender-race/ethnic meanings. Or in Bangladesh and other countries, shawls and […]