We’re celebrating the end of the year with our most popular posts from 2013, plus a few of our favorites tossed in. Enjoy!
Philosopher Sandra Lee Bartky once observed that being feminine often means using one’s body to portray powerlessness. Consider: A feminine person keeps her body small and contained; she makes sure that it doesn’t take up to much space or impose itself. She walks and sits in tightly packaged ways. She doesn’t cover the breadth of the sidewalk or expand herself beyond the chair she occupies. This comic from Chaos Life illustrates the point well..
Likewise, burping and farting, raising one’s voice in an argument, and even laughing loudly are considered distinctly unfeminine. A feminine person doesn’t use her body to forcefully interact with the world, she lets others do for her when possible. “Massiveness, power, or abundance in a woman’s body is met with distaste,” Bartky wrote.
Stunningly, when you think about it, these features of feminine body comportment are, in fact, not uniquely feminine, but associated with deference more generally. Bartky again:
In groups of men, those with higher status typically assume looser and more relaxed postures; the boss lounges comfortably behind the desk while the applicant sits tense and rigid on the edge of his seat. Higher-status individuals may touch their subordinates more than they themselves get touched; they initiate more eye contact and are smiled at by their inferiors more than they are observed to smile in return. What is announced in the comportment of superiors is confidence and ease…
Acting feminine, then, overlaps with performances of submissiveness. Both men and women use their bodies in more feminine ways when their interacting with a superior, whether it be their boss, their commander, a police officer, or their professor.
New evidence suggests that this is not pure theory. Psychologist Andy Yap and his colleagues tested whether “expansive body postures” like the ones associated with masculinity increase people’s sense of powerfulness and entitlement. They did. In laboratory experiments, people who were prompted to take up more space were more likely to steal, cheat, and violate traffic laws in a simulation. A sense of powerfulness, reported by the subjects, mediated the effect (a robust finding that others have documented as well).
In a real world test of the theory, they found that large automobiles with greater internal space were more likely than small ones to be illegally parked in New York City.
Research, then, has shown that expansive body postures that take up room instill a psychological sense of power and entitlement. The fact that this behavior is gendered may go some way towards explaining the persistence of gender inequality and, more pointedly, some men’s belief that they have earned their unearned privileges.
Cross-posted at Jezebel and Pacific Standard.
Lisa Wade, PhD is an Associate Professor at Tulane University. She is the author of American Hookup, a book about college sexual culture; a textbook about gender; and a forthcoming introductory text: Terrible Magnificent Sociology. You can follow her on Twitter and Instagram.
Comments 295
jfw11 — September 10, 2013
"Both men and women use their bodies in more feminine ways when their
interacting with a superior, whether it be their boss, their commander, a
police officer, or their professor"
Can we put "feminine" in quotes?
JJ — September 10, 2013
and while you are at it, you could correct "when their interacting". I believe you meant to write they're, or even better - they are.
Sophie — September 10, 2013
Never noticed much before, but I'm proud to be a girl that takes place and drives a Jeep! lol (But I drive very legally and hate people who think themselves above the law)
marilove — September 10, 2013
Did you not proof-read your piece? The errors in this are atrocious and growing by the moment. "that it doesn't take up to much space or impose itself. "
TOO much space. TOO much space.
to/too.
There is a difference.
mycomment — September 10, 2013
Careful and accurate use of language is another aspect of your skills. If you can not use correct English, it arouses doubts about your professional skills as well. These elementary mistakes should have been caught before publication. Heed these multiple comments—they are positive criticism. Accurate use of language is essential if you wish to exercise power in writing.
booksnmore4you — September 10, 2013
As a male, I'll just go ahead and let you know that it's painful for me to sit in posture typical of women. Sort of like kicking myself in the nuts.
Also, when a woman spreads her legs, it says something. Here at home, what follows with my wife is anything but painful. Out in the world, a woman sitting with her legs spread is like a man standing with his junk thrust forward.
K. C. — September 10, 2013
The comic used above is actually at this site: http://chaoslife.findchaos.com Please source correctly!
SI fan — September 10, 2013
Interesting content. See also great work by Amy Cuddy on the themes of physiological changes in response to adopting sterotypically male or female postures. For a quick rundown see: http://www.ted.com/talks/amy_cuddy_your_body_language_shapes_who_you_are.html
analog2000 — September 11, 2013
"large automobiles with greater internal space were more likely than small ones to be illegally parked in New York City"
I have no idea why this is, but there are a lot of other possibilities that are not mentioned. People who drive large (presumably more expensive) cars might be more willing to risk getting a ticket for convenience sake. They can afford to pay more than those driving a compact car. Maybe it is harder to find a parking space for a large car? Plenty of spaces where I live (not in NYC) are labeled "for compact cars only." Maybe people with large cars are more likely to live, work, or shop in areas with less on-street parking. Etc.
I think the article makes a good point, and you can see this phenomenon at work in any movie theatre or bus. But the car example is not a good one.
Jim Ru — September 11, 2013
Heterosexist. Women take on "masculine" attributes too. Some men are feminine in nature.
Andrew — September 11, 2013
Likewise, burping and farting, raising one’s voice in an argument, and even laughing loudly are considered distinctly unfeminine.
In many cultures these behaviors are regarded as universally rude and uncouth regardless of gender. A lot of this commentary is unintentionally limited to the Anglo-American/Northern European perspective on etiquette. And that's a shame, because there are so many different, fascinating variations on gendered body language around the world.
And the cultural relationships between gender and power are far from the only influential factors. For example, when it comes to the amount of space people take up when seated, there's a marked contrast between people from high-density cities and pretty much everyone else. A man who grew up riding the subway in Tokyo will generally be inclined toward a much more compact posture than a woman who grew up riding horses in Wyoming.
dagobarbz — September 11, 2013
I'm a small woman until I'm in an airplane seat. Then I expand like an angry owl to own the armrests.
MsMDub — September 11, 2013
women use their bodies in more feminine ways when they're* interacting with a superior
sasha Kocho-Williams — September 11, 2013
Reminds me of the conductor on the F train I used to commute on in NYC who would occassionally come on the PA and say 'one seat per person please. gentlemen, knees together!'
Guest — September 11, 2013
Good piece, by the way.
Bagelsan — September 11, 2013
Interesting article! It reminds me of the study that showed that female speaking was overestimated while male speech was underestimated; an even split of male and female voices resulted in men thinking the women talked too much/more than they did.
Athena — September 11, 2013
I disagree with the premise for the article in the first place which is
based on blanket generalizations and then assigning this view of relaxed
posture to be a "masculine vs. feminine" issue.
Scratching your ass in public,
sitting with your legs wide open, and taking up more space on the
sidewalk is not truly an assertion of power as the article suggests: it
is merely an outward presentation of lack of refinement.
**(Plus, just
cause a "man" is socially "allowed' to piss all over the toilet seat and
leave it up, doesn't mean that I should want to as well because this is
considered "alpha" or masculine behavior.)
In eastern cultures, as well
as many indigenous cultures there is an innate understanding that true
power is not an external value, but an internal one. Try to tell me that
the 80 year old yogi or the KungFu master who can break your neck with
two fingers holds less power.
Respecting the personal space of
others, as well as cultivating an awareness of how we choose to hold our
bodies out of self respect in no way reflects that we are being
oppressed by society. Nor is it a purely male vs. female issue. As
women, we shouldn't need to aspire to this level of lack of personal
awareness to prove we are powerful- and in fact, even arguing this point
is a male-centric perspective.
MicNikki — September 11, 2013
2 things:
1. "In laboratory experiments, people who were prompted to take up more
space were more likely to steal, cheat, and violate traffic laws in a
simulation." This is interesting to me, because many other analyses and studies on crime and immoral behaviour have suggested that stealing and cheating and breaking laws is actually indicative of a sense of powerLESSness - of feeling like there's no other option. It's a common theme in entertainment and art as well; think of Breaking Bad, for example, in which the main character resorts to manufacturing drugs to fund his cancer treatment. You could say that Walter White's criminal activity gave him a sense of power (oh boy could you say that) but he was initially DRIVEN to it because he felt powerless and vulnerable. I know this is fiction but I only bring it up as an example to illustrate that although this study might seem to be confirming common tropes, in fact it's actually disproving them: it's suggesting that someone already in a position of power is more likely to be driven to committing crime. Make of that what you will.
2. "They found that large automobiles with greater internal space were more
likely than small ones to be illegally parked in New York City." This isn't surprising but I feel they could have chosen a better test area than an incredibly densely packed and notoriously hard-to-park-in urban centre like NYC. Maybe the people with big cars were indeed being assholes, but maybe they also just had a harder time finding suitable parking.
Nicki Lisa Cole — September 11, 2013
Thanks for this great post Lisa! I look forward to using it in my Intro class this semester.
Ducky — September 11, 2013
I know that feel of empowerment really well! On the subway, on the buss and just generally around people i have a very "feminine", compact and tense body language. It's actually really exhausting when being in public for an entire day. But when I'm hanging out with my family or friends at home I'm relaxed, how I "really am". It's always so relieving to come home and be able to spread your legs and use the "masculine" body language again! ;) It's sad that what is seen as attractive in females is such god damn hard work.
David Orneallas — September 11, 2013
"In a real world test of the theory, they found that large automobiles
with greater internal space were more likely than small ones to be
illegally parked in New York City."
Have you ever tried to park a large vehicle in New York City? Of course more of them are illegally parked, there's some much less parking available for them.
Greygoss — September 11, 2013
Wow! If I follow her, will she give us the magic answer to getting men to acknowledge their grabs for unearned privileges?
Elizabeth Hungerford — September 11, 2013
I like this article. The association between feminine behavior and submission is a core element of WOMEN'S OPPRESSION. This is fundamental to feminist analysis.
"Acting feminine, then, overlaps with performances of submissiveness. Both men and women use their bodies in more feminine ways when their [sic] interacting with a superior, whether it be their boss, their commander, a police officer, or their professor."
"Research, then, has shown that expansive body postures that take up room instill a psychological sense of power and entitlement. The fact that this behavior is gendered may go some way towards explaining the persistence of gender inequality and, more pointedly, some men’s belief that they have earned their unearned privileges."
This is *precisely* why GENDER CRITICAL feminists protest the internalization of both "gender" as a general matter and "femininity" in particular as NOT essential to our female bodies or biology. Gender's disparate impact on women is why reframing "woman" as fundamentally constitutive of some kind of FREELY CHOSEN "identification" with the social constructs of femininity, I mean submission, is upsetting. And sexist. And woman-hating.
Gregory Susoreny — September 11, 2013
Yes, it is possible to affect masculinity. Too, there are naturally masculine women, as well as naturally hyper-women http://screen.yahoo.com/glamour/single-life-things-girls-test-140000008.html
Robert Stribley — September 11, 2013
I notice this a lot on the subway: "expansive body posture." I would often think, seriously, how can a guy a foot shorter than me take up so much space more than me. For example, I'm 6'3 and tend to sit with my legs crossed to reduce the room I take up, but many guys much shorter sit with their legs spread far apart. And then I realized that for some guys, it's probably a machismo thing. They may specifically consider crossing their legs "feminine," too. And the concept of "expansive body posture" totally gels with that. Mostly, I find them terribly annoying and lacking in self awareness!
Wayne Hoobler — September 11, 2013
How 'bout like physiological reasons, aka I have testicles.
Tamis Renteria — September 11, 2013
Gender inequality is enmeshed in our entire cultural system of inequality, so of course what is considered "feminine" behavior is also considered behavior appropriate to subordinates, children, and other people who are not considered full fledged (read "male") adults in our culture. Men with the full status of Manliness/Power get to fill out space with their bodies because the world belongs to them; the rest of us need to keep ourselves as small as we can so that there's enough room for them. And if you're lucky and male, you may get to grow up, or climb up the ladder, and become one of them. And some females can imitate them. But power is male by definition in our culture. That's the bottom line.
Bagelsan — September 11, 2013
I wish that fatness and physical expansiveness and power weren't all being conflated like this. It's got the weird effect of making fat women sound more "masculine" while thinner women are more "feminine" and I don't think that gender identification works like that. :p
Also, being physically larger isn't necessarily empowering -- if I gained 50 pounds I wouldn't suddenly feel super confident in my own skin, or show a corresponding increase in my self-perception as powerful. I'd just be 65 pounds overweight...
mark — September 11, 2013
Likewise, burping and farting, raising one’s voice in an argument, and
even laughing loudly are considered distinctly unfeminine. - they are also considered characteristic of lower status men!
kevin the kelly — September 11, 2013
Next time I see a "superior" i will curl up in a ball and slowly let out a fart.
Intriguing — September 11, 2013
I find the general argument very interesting. However, I find the relationship between vehicle interior space and illegally parked vehicles to be correlative rather than causal. Just because larger vehicles are more often parked illegally does not necessarily mean that owning a larger vehicle CAUSES one to be prone to parking illegally. It could just as easily be backwards. People who are prone to parking illegally could prefer driving larger vehicles. I agree that it is possible, even likely, given the evidence in the article. I just don't like the use of an analogous correlation to provide evidence towards a point without acknowledging it's weaknesses.
Lunad — September 11, 2013
It's exhausting as an overweight woman to try to take up as little space as possible.
Jaycey Rae — September 11, 2013
2 errors in the article. Big deal. I'd love to see how many errors your PhD thesis has. Wait, what's that? You don't have PhD's? Then stfu because a few errors doesn't take away her credit.
Henrietta — September 11, 2013
I think in an article like this, with such good basis and foundation, it is important to keep up correct grammar and spelling. Therefore, I would simply like to point out to the author that she made a mistake and mispelled they're* in the 4th paragraph. Other than that, excellent article :) Thank you.
Sally — September 11, 2013
I don't sit with my legs open in a dress, not to represent my meek feminine nature and to not take up much-deserved power/space, but rather in order to not flash my fucking panties or vag at strangers. The more we discuss micro-actions of the genders or races in this way where one is subconsciously minimized, the further we move away from an unbiased, non-separated discussion of humankind as a whole. Give me a break with this freakin' article.
Kaptain Badrukk — September 12, 2013
Got to say, on the bus to work today I relaxed my shoulders and neck a bit, widened my stance and I'll be damned if i didn't feel more in control of my environment. I'm quite a bulky guy, and I was very big for my age until about 16-17 when everyone started catching up. So I've always consciously tried to make myself smaller, it was a defense mechanism then, and it's just carried over now.
Totally not going back.
Also agree with Sally, the constant inspection of gender/race behavior and attitudes only serves to forge a stronger sense of difference between people.
Réponse à un ami culturiste | Le blog de Fikmonskov — September 12, 2013
[...] fout ? C’est parce que l’homme est une ordure patriarcale qui exploite la femme. La femme a en société des attitudes proches de celles des hommes qui ont le rang le plus bas dans ... ? C’est parce qu’on ne cesse de lui rappeler qu’elle est faite pour être [...]
Guest — September 12, 2013
Personally, I have no inclination towards sitting spread-eagled like
I'm a 'too cool for school' 13-year-old. I'm glad Otto linked this
because I find it aptly showcases how pointless it is to look for
gender-inequality in everything. People generally sit how they want, not
how the patriarchy tells them to. Don't get me wrong, there's a whole
lot of genuine gender-inequality issues going both ways but I really
don't see it in how people sit. If I were an employer, I would, with
100% certainty, hire the person on the left because, like Anski said, it
looks more efficient and imho more professional and mature. So, where's
the the real power display now?
Christopher Smith — September 12, 2013
Personally, I have no inclination towards sitting spread-eagled like
I'm a 'too cool for school' 13-year-old. This aptly showcases how pointless it is to look for
gender-inequality in everything. People generally sit how they want, not
how the patriarchy tells them to. Don't get me wrong, there's a whole
lot of genuine gender-inequality issues going both ways but I really
don't see it in how people sit. If I were an employer, I would, with
100% certainty, hire the person on the left because it
looks more efficient and imho more professional and mature. So, where's
the the real power display now?
Daily Roundup Sept 12th | Tati's Tidbits — September 12, 2013
[...] Gender and the Body Language of Power [...]
Christine Spencer — September 12, 2013
Gender policing at its finest.
Really? Big cars are more likely to be over lines? Ummm...duh.
Bangs head on desk.
Bhargavi Twarakavi — September 12, 2013
i conduct my self that way towards people i admire or respect. i look up at such people. it is not being submissive.
Adriana — September 12, 2013
why the need to open the legs and arms to feels powerfull? women can express their power with body language in a different way than men do. Do we have to spit and burp too??! I´ve heard some whispers of women much louder and felt much deeper than any smelly noisy burp. No need to have cavewomen gestures to be powerfull. Anyone can see a powerfull person (man or woman) miles away. Its not the appearances that we need to address, its the being.
EvilPundit — September 12, 2013
Yet more feminist sexism. Now men are evil oppressors because they sit the wrong way!
This is feminism in its death-spiral, becoming more ridiculous every day.
Gender and the Body Language of Power | octopractical — September 12, 2013
[...] Gender and the Body Language of Power. [...]
Lidia Zitara — September 12, 2013
In my opinion this behavoiur is rude and impolite, both genders.
Dee — September 12, 2013
I guess I'm not feminine.
Nadia — September 12, 2013
Brilliant. And informative. Even though I have observed, and experienced, this behavior myself, it is difficult to explain or pin point exactly where the submissiveness manners appear in women, even though I inherently feel it myself when acting that way.
And "some men’s belief that they have earned their unearned privileges", great wording.
Helen — September 12, 2013
A blog post that uses casual transphobia.
I thought this link might be interesting in light of our recent discussion. | Psychology 11 — September 13, 2013
[...] Check out this link. [...]
Homework Due on 9/16 (11A) / 9/17 (11B) | CDS Honors English 11 — September 13, 2013
[...] The article we discussed today can be found here. [...]
What We’ve Been Reading | UpRoot — September 13, 2013
[...] Gender and the Body Language of Power [...]
'Men Taking Up Too Much Space On The Train' Tumblr Raises Some Interesting Questions About Being Male In Public » For Women » Funnystake.com — September 13, 2013
[...] a Sept. 11 blog post for The Society Pages, sociology professor Lisa Wade wrote about how gender can impact body [...]
mimimur — September 13, 2013
This is purely acnedotal, but I've experienced at least two cases recently where men have used this kind behaviour while flirting - arms wide, legs out, taking up as much space as possible - and I've been wondering about the link to rape culture if there is a pattern here. Sticking out from a chair, his legs are blocking the exit, under the table they almost go under your chair on the opposite side and you have to really make an effort not to touch them, and stretching on the sofa you have to lean into him or be pushed off. Really creepy behavior.
Lovely Links: 9/13/13 — September 13, 2013
[...] Sandra Lee Bartky once observed that being feminine often means using one’s body to portray powerlessness. Consider: A feminine person keeps her body small and contained; she makes sure that it doesn’t [...]
Links 6 – 14/9/13 | Alastair's Adversaria — September 13, 2013
[...] 49. Gender and the Body Language of Power [...]
'Men Taking Up Too Much Space On The Train' Tumblr Raises Some Interesting Questions About Being Male In Public - Freshwadda Brooks | Coming Soon! — September 13, 2013
[...] a Sept. 11 blog post for The Society Pages, sociology professor Lisa Wade wrote about how gender can impact body [...]
exhaleddreams — September 13, 2013
Why does the first half of this article focus on the powerlessness of feminine behaviour, when the study was about assertive power from male postures? Why do postures that are not expansive have to be powerless - could they be called something like respectful instead? This continues to use male traits as positive and female traits as negative, when we should be seeing value in all. An interesting example on perspective: http://acceptableparity.blogspot.ca/2011/10/four-ways-men-stunt-womens-careers.html
‘Men Taking Up Too Much Space On The Train’ Tumblr Raises Some Interesting … – Huffington PostSanok Silik | Sanok Silik — September 14, 2013
[...] a Sept. 11 blog post fοr Thе Society Pages, sociology professor Lisa Wade wrote аbουt hοw gender саn impact body [...]
'Men Taking Up Too Much Space On The Train' Tumblr Raises Some Interesting Questions About Being Male In Public | Greater Denver CO — September 14, 2013
[...] a Sept. 11 blog post for The Society Pages, sociology professor Lisa Wade wrote about how gender can impact body [...]
Welcome to Monday ~ 16 September 2013 | feminaust ~ for australian feminism — September 15, 2013
[...] Gender and the body language of power – this totally made me think more about how I inhabit space. [...]
Gender and the body language of power | Rocketboom — September 16, 2013
[...] Gender and the body language of power Source: http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2013/09/10/gendered-and-the-body-language-of-power/ 0 &nb... [...]
Susan — September 16, 2013
"The fact that this behavior is gendered"
Is that a fact? Or did you just cherry pick a subset of things that could be called feminine that conveniently fit your story?
As a counter example you could look at the way models are being trained for the catwalk (supposedly the ultimate feminine look): wearing high highs makes you taller, it isn't "taking up as little space as possible". Swinging your hips from side to side also isn't "taking up as little space as possible".
Burping and farting in public is also not really appropriate for men, either.
When reading feminist articles one should also watch out for the narrative that is conveyed between the lines, that is, the unproven claims (like "men fart in public to create an air of power") that are slipped by the reader as "facts".
Ruth — September 16, 2013
This is a seriously flawed "study" if you can call it that. They are approaching the data with preconceived notions and then drawing simplistic conclusions. The people who take up more space are obnoxious and entitled jerks whether male or female. I don't find that attitude appealing and it doesn't necessarily take you far in a career. When men sit in an "expansive" position, I find it to be a real put off. I actually find "feminine" positions to be more respectful and well-mannered. Remember these habits and mannerisms were cultivated throughout European history as a sign of the upper class and cultured background. I don't think any of the lower classes at the time were feeling more powerful in their more "expansive" body language.
Tim — September 16, 2013
Large automobiles are more likely to be illegally parked in NYC because it's incredibly difficult to find street parking in NYC. Naturally, the larger the vehicle, the less likely it will fit into any potentially available spot. A small car can fit anywhere, making it easier to find parking. This is not a good example for this article.
Feminism | cokenned — September 16, 2013
[...] http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2013/09/10/gendered-and-the-body-language-of-power/ [...]
Yohei Nakajima — September 17, 2013
Isn't this behavior true amongst most primates? And if so, is it just amongst humans that this discrepancy between males and females is concerning?
Sin Palabras: ¿Qué comunica el cuerpo cuando estamos de pie? | EN BUSCA DE ANTARES. — September 17, 2013
[...] Gender and the Body Language of Power: http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2013/09/10/gendered-and-the-body-language-of-power/ [...]
Alice Zindagi Pua — September 17, 2013
I would extend this beyond the board room and suggest that men who can act like they're more dominant - i.e.: like they have more power - would have a higher sex appeal to the average woman. Think about it. Whereas men are attracted to the golden ratio in women of a 0.7 waist-to-hip ratio, women tend to be more attracted to broad shoulders (a "triangular" torso). Broad shoulders take up more space and signal a powerful man who is not afraid to take charge and get what he wants. That's sexy. It's also really easy to learn if you know what you're doing:
http://www.abcsofattraction.com/blog/walk-of-khan-approach-sexually-attractive-women-with-confidence/
O.Taleb — September 19, 2013
i must say this study is flawed because of the gender base argument. Body language is just that. body language..as for the psychology,that also is a human thing and not gender base. how we perceive women or men is based on our acceptance. example. you only do to me what i allow you to do and not what you want to do. Awareness for all genders is the cure. And i do agree that women in general especially in the past were suppressed and abused as the weaker sex.But think with me for a little. When women got higher positions in their jobs they treated the work force men and women just like the men. So as you can see there is a human element about the behavior regardless of gender.
One Woman Show: It Begins | Hannah Chutzpah — September 19, 2013
[...] much covers what I was initially talking about with womens’ body language in lesbian bars: http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2013/09/10/gendered-and-the-body-language-of-power/ That on a body-language basis: ‘femininity’ and ‘submissiveness/low [...]
Friday Sex Links! | Sex with Timaree — September 20, 2013
[...] Body language and gender. Is the Genderbread Person a work of plagiarism? [...]
Chris — September 20, 2013
You're a professor and don't know the different between their and they're?
divadarya — September 29, 2013
This totally explains the balls on the back of pickup trucks.
מגדר וכוחה של שפת הגוף | שולפת צפורניים — October 1, 2013
[...] מקור: ד"ר ליסה ווייד תרגום: ליאן טל [...]
Robert Tye — October 1, 2013
unearned privilege is redundant.
Longest List of Links Yet! | Temperance — October 1, 2013
[...] my Fellow Furious yet Fun Feminists, Queer, and Allies >> On gender and body language. >> An interview with an asexual person–for those who’ve never had an open [...]
GemmaSeymour — October 1, 2013
Whenever issues of sociology arise in public fora, I have lately become struck by the extent to which people will insist that a lack of scientific objectivity in a study automatically equates with irrelevance. I wonder if some of the commenters here insisted on doing a double-blind study before they put on their pants this morning. It doesn't take a peer-reviewed journal article to take a look around you and draw conclusions from behavior which is commonplace.
But one thing I take issue with here is that, as a person whose mannerisms have been influenced by her Asian heritage, much of the behavior of women in a western cultural context leans toward the masculine side of the spectrum, even in comparison to Asian men. I often experience women "taking up too much space" for my comfort, particularly in the ways in which they invade my personal space, even going so far as to come into physical contact with me, and demand that I give way to them in public settings, like pushing a shopping cart down a narrow store aisle, and expecting others who were there first to yield to their rude behavior. I will also note that behavior that would be read as feminine in the west may have entirely different connotations in the east. Rather than being classified as 'masculine' or 'feminine', the more appropriate culturally dependent axis might be 'polite' or 'impolite', 'refined' or 'crude'.
I came across this article because it was shared on Facebook by Virginia Hankins, a woman who famously flouts conventions of gendered behavior by performing as a professional jouster in armor, something that most people tend to believe was not an activity open to women in history. Some of the comments on Virginia's post, seemingly non-sequiturs, focused on the idea that certain women's genitals "get in the way" of "lady-like" posture, specifically the disposition of one's legs. I found these comments highly transmisogynistic, and I question the choice of the illustration above, as well as the intent of the illustrator, despite the fact that so far as I can tell, the comic in question is intended to be semi-autobiographical, and about two lesbian women. There is no indication I have found as to whether or not either of them are trans women.
However, the fact is, and I don't need a double-blind study to understand this, that the illustration above is going to be read by a lot of people as the shorter-haired character being male. This has opened the floor to comments that disparage trans women, and that makes me very uncomfortable.
Sadly, the world of feminism has been particularly harsh for trans women, and anytime I see a woman, particularly a feminist woman, talking about the topic of gender in any way, I am automatically suspicious of the intent of the author, especially when no explicit statements that can be read as supporting trans women are included. You see, it's not enough to speak in generic terms about women, because that is exactly the tactic taken by those who wish to erase trans women's experiences as women, and not incidentally, the exact same tactic taken by men who wish to disempower women as a class.
I think it's no stretch of the imagination to say that although strictly speaking burping, farting, etc. is not considered polite behavior for anyone, the disapprobation faced by women for these behaviors is far more severe than it is for men. This is self-evidently, empirically true in every culture, east or west, north or south.
Still, we should give more thought to the words of early radical feminist turned critic of radical feminism, Ellen Willis, when she said in 1984 that "the impulse to dominate… could be a universal human characteristic that women share, even if they have mostly lacked the opportunity to exercise it." I believe that instances of "taking up too much space" have less to do with gender, and more to do with the overly large sense of entitlement that many people possess, whatever sex/gender they happen to be.
Gender and the Body Language of Power — October 2, 2013
[...] post originally appeared on Sociological Images, a Pacific Standard partner site. Comic by A. Stiffler [...]
Jeremy — October 10, 2013
"Both men and women use their bodies in more feminine ways when THEY'RE interacting with a superior..."
Body Language Cards — October 20, 2013
Check out these Body Language Cards I just got from Amazon. There were very helpful http://amzn.to/1i5us1N
Chique — October 25, 2013
I spread out my body andI'ma chique. I get it though!
JustineLera — November 2, 2013
A most thorough survey of the poses taken by men and women, and the poses of men and women in the history of sculpture, is of course documented in Marianne Wex's famous "Let's take back our Space", first published in 1979. You can flip through the book at
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ScoOF2GDFrM .
An exhibition of the original photo panels was recently shown in the US: http://yaleunion.org/marianne-wex/
and includes a link to a pdf of the English version of the book:
http://yaleunion.org/lib/pdf/Marianne-Wex--Let%27s-Take-Back-Our-Space.pdf
perspective please — November 2, 2013
Only one man in that article has "privileges" and that is that relaxed high status male. The rest of the men and women are all crossing their legs, smiling and showing submission. Meanwhile the rest of those low status males are suffering the gender criticism of the article and unfounded disdain of the other women. and when a beautiful woman walks in the room everybody looses their status to her and it won't matter how she sits or how much space she takes up.
pepe_br99 — November 3, 2013
This is the way it's always been, and it works
Deane — December 17, 2013
Good article Lisa Wade,
It strikes me as interesting that the "feminine etiquette" that you cited is relegated as a relic from a past century for many women. Many younger women (ask any 80 year old, and they'll tell you) are unconcerned with those standards.
How is this change in attitudes toward "femininity" related to the changes that have simultaneously taken place in social, economic and relational dimensions of gender and sex? Which came first? Is there a causal relationship?
Thanks
Juulia Hanna Metsävuori — December 18, 2013
Meh, I'm female and I sit however the fuck I want. As long as I'm not being rude to anyone else, I don't care if my legs are crossed or put tightly together or not.
I don't really care how men sit either. As long as they move if someone wants the open seat next to them, then whatever.
I take public transit every day and see all kinds of people sitting in a variety of ways. It's definitely not limited to one gender over the other.
Angie Luci Daniels — December 27, 2013
Acting "feminine" means to me that you are more cultured. While I do burp in public because my brother and I find loud burps hilarious, anyone, male or female, who farts in public to me is just a pig. Not masculine, certainly not "strong", just a PIG. How about we evolve towards better MANNERS FOR ALL?
Dan Levitan — December 27, 2013
Then can someone explain why the 4'9" Korean-born social studies teacher at my school is one of the most feared women in the entire CITY?
Scot Conway — December 28, 2013
True that taking up more space shows power and dominance in body language. There are typically male ways of doing it, more grown up masculine ways of doing it, and feminine ways of doing it that still exert dominance. If a woman still wishes to be perceived as feminine and also desires to be perceived as powerful, there are tools available to her.
Splaying arms, steeple with the hands, stand arms akimbo, and such are examples.
eccles11 — December 28, 2013
I don't disagree with most of this, I don't counted that there isn't body language of power, and that most of the examples brought up are accurate. But I must bring up an important point that may not be obvious to some.
If you google "macho public transport", you will find a site where Swedish feminists send in pictures of men taking up to much space on public transport. Almost all of these images are of men with their knees apart.
I need to make this clear. That sitting position is not an expression of power, depending on ones attire, it may be the only way to avoid excruciating pain in a tender area. There is a scrotum between those legs and having those squished feels very much light a strong punch to the gut.
I'm sure if many men could, they would sit with their knees together. As someone who recently endured a 16 hour plane flight in the middle seat, I'd have given my left testicle to be able to have that space between my knees available to me.
I'm not having a go at anyone here, I just want to give an explanation for a specific position that is better explained by biology than sociology.
zerobeat — December 28, 2013
Hmmm, this might explain why casual observation tells me that jerks tend to be dissproportionatly represented by SUV drivers.
[links] Link salad wakes up back East | jlake.com — December 28, 2013
[…] Gender and the Body Language of Power — On a trivial note, I particularly like the bit about large cars. […]
Mats Mattsson Boström — December 28, 2013
The enormous problem with this article, like so many other compilations of pseudo-feminist pop-culture, is not that it's ENTIRELY wrong, but that it's about as fair and balanced as fox news. The main question one needs to ask one self after reading this is: How come upperclass men are described as effeminate and how come when someone burps after eating i would immediately come to the conclusion that they below to a lower social class than my self?
How come the street-artists i know who come from less priviliged backgrounds would typically fit the "bad male" stereotype better than the "fine" artists i know? How come Louis XIV wore breeches, high heeled shoes and a fake poodle haircut and was simultaneously considered the epitomization of royal power?
While one's at it, one might just as well go through every facebook-feminist article one has read in the last year and change every "women have to" to "women can" and every "men can" to "men have to". If the result, after carefull consideration, seems equally true on average to the original one might consider if patterns of systematically describing women as victims and men as perpetrators are in fact sexist.
Dance Pedagogy and Dance Therapy Research | Visual Pedagogies — December 28, 2013
[…] http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2013/12/27/gendered-and-the-body-language-of-power/ […]
TheEmperorIsStarkers — December 28, 2013
This problem even has its own tumblr... http://movethefuckoverbro.tumblr.com/
“Acting Feminine” Means Portraying Powerlessness | World Weird — December 30, 2013
[…] Read more here. […]
Tuesday Wrap Up | Sex with Timaree — December 31, 2013
[…] Gender and the body language of power. […]
Cassandra Grindall — December 31, 2013
I had a young Chinese guest recently, she sat with her hands out over the booth in a restaurant. It was such a noticeable and confident posture for a small, young woman to take...and beautiful to behold. As a transwoman I know seating posture especially is something I have to be aware of. Boys are never taught how they must sit in our culture, and girls are...constantly.
LanceSmith — December 31, 2013
Gotta love man-shamming!
Let's hope that in the new year, feminists find a different tactic…because the incessant man-shaming is becoming tiresome. For a movement that says it is all about equality (which by their definition means female empowerment), they spend a lot of time talking about how broken men are. Seems like more of an inferiority complex then anything else.
#confuzzled — December 31, 2013
How are these assertions about what is acceptable and what isn't being determined?
Is this based on surveys? Double-blind studies?
babayaga — January 1, 2014
*they're interacting with a superior. i expected more from a PhD.
Atanas Bozhkov — January 2, 2014
I don't like the correlation between the internal space of the car and the chance of parking illegally. It might add to the underlying factors, but in the general case spacious cars are usually more expensive - which "signifies" entitlement and wealth.
On being loud and taking up space | Feminist Philosophers — January 15, 2014
[…] Lisa Wade’s Gender and the Body Language of Power for a nice discussion of the ways women are socialized to be quiet, demure, and not take up […]
Tumblr Expedition II | Part Time Monster — January 16, 2014
[…] in a way that continues to perpetuate privilege, systemic oppression, and violence.” And yes, that is a real thing. I picked up both these links from Feminist […]
It must be Friday! | Sourcerer — January 17, 2014
[…] also found NOLA Feminizer, Feminist Philosphers, Lisa Wade, and a very well-thought-0ut Tumblr page. I like them. I hope you do, […]
Self defense is a feminist issue | Fit, Feminist, and (almost) Fifty — January 18, 2014
[…] Lisa Wade’s Gender and the Body Language of Power for a nice discussion of the ways women are socialized to be quiet, demure, and not take up […]
Gender and the Body Language of Power | Flip It Right Side Up — January 19, 2014
[…] Gender and the Body Language of Power. […]
Taking Up Space | Feminism and Women's Bodies — January 19, 2014
[…] Lastly, a small article about body language from The Society Pages: http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2013/12/27/gendered-and-the-body-language-of-power/ […]
Nada por qué excitarse: la cosificación sexual. | Psicoloquio — February 10, 2014
[…] las habituales dietas y visitas al gimnasio. A nivel micro, muchas mujeres tienden a un minucioso monitoreo del cuerpo que no se ve con frecuencia en los hombres: cómo se sientan, cómo se ven, cómo hablan, cuál es […]
Ralph Lauren — February 11, 2014
Wait, let me get this straight: you "tested the theory" by observing cars? I'm gonna have to point out that's totally invalid.
Big Thinky Post on Permission (with audience participation) | Hannah Chutzpah — March 23, 2014
[…] Gender and the Body Language of Power […]
Manne-skrevere | Under Arbeid — March 29, 2014
[…] samler kroppen, krysser armene og beskytter våre utsatte deler, som hals, bryst og underliv. Filosofen Sandra Lee Bartky skriver at en feminin kropp ofte minimerer plassen den tar opp og utviser maktesløshet, mens en […]
She walks and sits in tightly packaged ways » Butterflies and Wheels — April 1, 2014
[…] What about women and body language and power? Lisa Wade did a post about that awhile ago at Sociological Images. […]
Behaving Like a Man | Colin Gautrey | The Influence Blog — April 27, 2014
[…] Gender and the Body Language of Power, Lisa Wade, PhD, co-author of Gender, Ideas, Interactions, Institutions. New York, W. W. Norton & Co. […]
Axel Peterman — May 5, 2014
Well, there are other reasons that men sit like that; actually there are two of them.
Eric Jacobus — May 15, 2014
In laboratory experiments, men who were prompted to take up more space were more likely to steal, cheat, and violate traffic laws in a simulation. They were also more likely to be sexy for reasons that female spectators couldn't explain.
Body Language: Fit for Purpose? | Colin Gautrey | The Influence Blog — May 22, 2014
[…] GENDER AND THE BODY LANGUAGE OF POWER, Lisa Wade, PhD, co-author of Gender: Ideas, Interactions, Institutions. New York: W.W. Norton & Co. […]
TarnishedSophia — June 11, 2014
I think it's very important to note that this might be "feminine" behavior and body language, but not necessarily the body language of female-bodied people. I am technically a woman due to my body, but have always found it more comfortable and relaxing to sit/lounge/speak like a man (be vocal about my opinions, sit with legs open or ankle up on knee, arms across the back of the couch or at least not absurdly tucked in, etc.). This could just be from having all male friends for the majority of my life, or because of my gender dysphoria, but people should know that having a female body doesn't automatically mean you'll have constrained body language.
MaleMatters — June 17, 2014
Re: "Research, then, has shown that expansive body postures that take up room instill a psychological sense of power and entitlement."
I'm reminded of a group-therapy session for prisoners I saw on TV recently. All the young men, who happened to be black, sat in expansive body postures that took up room.
Since when did young black male prisoners feel a sense of power and entitlement?
What power and entitlement does any man feel? Please provide me a bulleted list, and I will provide a list of women's power and entitlement.
Many of men's and women's different postures result from what I think is the sexes' most alienating and destructive behavioral difference:
"The Sexual Harassment Quagmire" at http://malemattersusa.wordpress.com/2011/12/11/the-sexual-harassment-quagmire/
The sexist Lisa Wade needs to walk a mile in men's shoes so that she knows at least a tiny bit about men before writing from her stack-the-deck-against-men perspective,
Space | souls of my feet — July 2, 2014
[…] http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2013/12/27/gendered-and-the-body-language-of-power/ […]
Guerre des sexes: Les transports new-yorkais s’attaquent à la fertilité masculine (Dude, close your legs: From manspreading to infertility spreading ?) | jcdurbant — January 7, 2015
[…] Psychologist Andy Yap and his colleagues tested whether “expansive body postures” like the ones associated with masculinity increase people’s sense of powerfulness and entitlement. They did. In laboratory experiments, people who were prompted to take up more space were more likely to steal, cheat, and violate traffic laws in a simulation. A sense of powerfulness, reported by the subjects, mediated the effect (a robust finding that others have documented as well). In a real world test of the theory, they found that large automobiles with greater internal space were more likely than small ones to be illegally parked in New York City. Lisa Wade […]
Reckless Speculations About the Psychology of Misusing “Bitch” and “Creep” | Saner Than Lasagna — January 14, 2015
[…] [7]http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2013/12/27/gendered-and-the-body-language-of-power […]
Can we pretend our way to becoming anti-oppressive educators? | Raquel Bellefleur's Professional Portfolio — February 8, 2015
[…] but I do think of it as performing because I’ve learned to act, walk, speak, and even take up space in “feminine ways” through regulated discourses of what it means to be female since before I […]
BillClitone — March 9, 2015
I love how people say they were "taught" to behave this way. I missed those classes. no one "taught" me any of this stuff.
Cg — August 21, 2015
Wow! Thank you Lisa for your insightful analysis of how it feels to get hit in the testicles. It's incredible that a female like Lisa can understand just how it feels to be struck there. I'm guessing you've kicked a few boyfriends in the balls and thought nothing of it? Just because they said something wrong that you disagree with... Either way we don't do it because it's dishonorable. I think women like Lisa need to learn the definition of this word a bit better. Too bad you don't have balls because if you got kicked in the you'd know the definition of dishonorable immediately. Why is a women without balls writing this article???
Derek Jetter — September 14, 2015
It would be nice to see women showing more overt dominance rather than passive aggressive bullshit like this author. Typical coward talk... get angry at others for your own shortcomings.
td — January 5, 2016
Vebblen in 'The theory of the leisure class' in addition to this also argued that this plus the mode of dressing are a sort of self mutilation, a means of communicating that one is not only exempt from labor but also that one cannot even participate in it. According to him, the leiaure class can prove their status not just by dressing in expensive garments but dressing in garments that incapacitate them. There is also a cultural baggage suggested in behaving meekly especially one is to be submissive to another. This is featured in other institutions and is thus not unique in economic ones. The world of fashion is well oriented to both, the mode of incapacitating dressing and a show of physical weakness in behavior.
Dating with russian – revealing effortless russiansbrides secrets | Student Blog — January 1, 2020
[…] comes to the implications of an pattern of contacts they may have documented among Trump contacts https://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2013/12/27/gendered-and-the-body-language-of-power/ and Russians — contacts that occurred just before, during and after Russian intelligence […]
Why males select russian brides? russian women to marry – PT.Cakrabumi Energi Nusantara — January 16, 2020
[…] facilitate appointment times with respect to religious expertise in individual Russian govt simply https://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2013/12/27/gendered-and-the-body-language-of-power/ does not have manpower to enforce its own ban. Why Russian women are actually as a result pleasing […]
Big ass latina fucked dyke dating sites – little women russian – TrainNow — January 22, 2020
[…] ease and also level of comfort Russian better half makes producing https://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2013/12/27/gendered-and-the-body-language-of-power/ by using hand-made facts, therefore where you are become different location. Can it be a lipstick […]
Why males select russian brides? russian women to marry – Sustainable Free Society — January 29, 2020
[…] facilitate appointment times with respect to religious expertise in individual Russian govt simply https://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2013/12/27/gendered-and-the-body-language-of-power/ does not have manpower to enforce its own ban. Why Russian women are actually as a result pleasing […]
Most noticeable hot russian brides on the market place russian women looking for a man – PKL I PLUS SILVER AND GOLD — January 29, 2020
[…] appears so straightforward that you browse it and wonder just how anyone ever gets caught acting https://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2013/12/27/gendered-and-the-body-language-of-power/ differently — but when you’re in the middle of a series of e-mail going back and forth, […]
Where he met a girl from russia? - Estrattore di succo — March 23, 2020
[…] to call her loved ones with the phone or simply Skype ip telefoni. On top of that, it really is https://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2013/12/27/gendered-and-the-body-language-of-power/ astonishingly significant, to become truthful. Keep in mind that every single organization delivers […]
Tohru is Tohru: the Onigiri Who Finds her Place - Anime Marvel — May 11, 2021
[…] accept hospitality or kindness unless she’s doing something in return? Lisa Wade notes in “Gender and the Body Language of Power” that “[a] feminine person keeps her body small and contained; she makes sure that it […]
Weekly Round-Up, 5-11 May 2021: Olympics Protests, Tokyo Revengers, and Anti-Muslim Discrimination - Anime Feminist — May 11, 2021
[…] accept hospitality or kindness unless she’s doing something in return? Lisa Wade notes in “Gender and the Body Language of Power” that “[a] feminine person keeps her body small and contained; she makes sure that it […]
Manspreading: Myth, Message, or Management? – Languaged Life — April 15, 2024
[…] Wade, Lisa (2013). Gender and the body language of power—Sociological images. Retrieved February 3, 2023, from https://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2013/12/27/gendered-and-the-body-language-of-power […]