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	<title>Comments on: &#8220;Black Pete&#8221; (NSFW)</title>
	<atom:link href="http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/12/24/black-pete/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/12/24/black-pete/</link>
	<description>Sociological Images encourages people to exercise and develop their sociological imaginations with discussions of compelling visuals that span the breadth of sociological inquiry.</description>
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		<title>By: Patti</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/12/24/black-pete/comment-page-1/#comment-566890</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Patti]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 26 Dec 2012 09:05:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=6380#comment-566890</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Unfortunately an African American in one of my classes was wearing her hair out in and was wearing red lipstick and a child came and asked Swarte Piet for sweets thinking she was him.  Sorry, but kids do indeed think that Swarte Piet is a black person.  The Belgians defend it to death, but it is ridiculous...
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/netherlands/9687877/Dutch-Christmas-parade-under-fire-for-blacked-up-Santas-helpers.html#]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Unfortunately an African American in one of my classes was wearing her hair out in and was wearing red lipstick and a child came and asked Swarte Piet for sweets thinking she was him.  Sorry, but kids do indeed think that Swarte Piet is a black person.  The Belgians defend it to death, but it is ridiculous&#8230;<br />
<a href="http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/netherlands/9687877/Dutch-Christmas-parade-under-fire-for-blacked-up-Santas-helpers.html#" rel="nofollow">http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/netherlands/9687877/Dutch-Christmas-parade-under-fire-for-blacked-up-Santas-helpers.html#</a></p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Dream Destination: Christmas in Europe - meganotravels &#124; meganotravels</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/12/24/black-pete/comment-page-1/#comment-565418</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Dream Destination: Christmas in Europe - meganotravels &#124; meganotravels]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Dec 2012 05:59:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=6380#comment-565418</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] via [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[&#8230;] via [&#8230;]</p>
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		<title>By: GG</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/12/24/black-pete/comment-page-1/#comment-541236</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[GG]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Dec 2011 15:54:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=6380#comment-541236</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Yup - there it is.  He was a slave.


Until the second half of the 20th century, Saint Nicholas&#039; helper was not too bright, in line with the old colonial traditions. Once immigration started from the former colonised countries Zwarte Piet became a much more respected assistant of Saint Nicholas, who is often a bit inattentive, but playfull.[8]
]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yup &#8211; there it is.  He was a slave.</p>
<p>Until the second half of the 20th century, Saint Nicholas&#8217; helper was not too bright, in line with the old colonial traditions. Once immigration started from the former colonised countries Zwarte Piet became a much more respected assistant of Saint Nicholas, who is often a bit inattentive, but playfull.[8]</p>
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		<title>By: M. M. Amir ( a moslem)</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/12/24/black-pete/comment-page-1/#comment-540249</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[M. M. Amir ( a moslem)]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 04 Dec 2011 02:27:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=6380#comment-540249</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[A more accurate description of Sinterklaas and Zwarte Piet can be found in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinterklaas.
Zwarte Piet was a slave, who was bought and liberated by Sinterklaas.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A more accurate description of Sinterklaas and Zwarte Piet can be found in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sinterklaas.<br />
Zwarte Piet was a slave, who was bought and liberated by Sinterklaas.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: shorelines</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/12/24/black-pete/comment-page-1/#comment-426497</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[shorelines]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Dec 2010 17:09:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=6380#comment-426497</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I am dying to know why the comments were closed.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am dying to know why the comments were closed.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Inny</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/12/24/black-pete/comment-page-1/#comment-426385</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Inny]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 26 Dec 2010 09:26:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=6380#comment-426385</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I agree with you on all points (I&#039;m from Holland too). I actually find this poist kind of offending.  Everybody loves black Piet. The idea of a black face comes originally from the dirt in the chimney. I don&#039;t know why people gave Piet earrings and red lips, but it is something they have added later. Correct me if I&#039;m wrong, but I believe there has been controversy around black Piet, but that has ebbed away because the white people made a problem out of it instead of the people who would supposedly be offended. I strongly believe black piet is not percieved as racism by colored people if they grew up here.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with you on all points (I&#8217;m from Holland too). I actually find this poist kind of offending.  Everybody loves black Piet. The idea of a black face comes originally from the dirt in the chimney. I don&#8217;t know why people gave Piet earrings and red lips, but it is something they have added later. Correct me if I&#8217;m wrong, but I believe there has been controversy around black Piet, but that has ebbed away because the white people made a problem out of it instead of the people who would supposedly be offended. I strongly believe black piet is not percieved as racism by colored people if they grew up here.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: erik smit</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/12/24/black-pete/comment-page-1/#comment-425312</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[erik smit]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 23 Dec 2010 14:16:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=6380#comment-425312</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Okay, here&#039;s a few thoughts from Holland: 

Lulu Helder&#039;s claims that &quot;He or she will speak improper Dutch with a low voice and a Surinamese accent.&quot; are not true - unless she saw a Zwarte Piet who was actually Surinamese (they&#039;re an important minority, mainly in Amsterdam) of course. It is Sinterklaas, not Zwarte Piet, who speaks in a low voice.

What hasn&#039;t been mentioned yet is that of the two characters, Sinterklaas is generally strict and stern. Nothing like Santa Claus. Zwarte Piet is generally funny, friendly and approachable, and kids love him. 

I find the &#039;not safe for work&#039; comment very strange, by the way. But apparently the Americans have a similar character who does have racist connotations - this would explain why Americans often think the character of Zwarte Piet is racist. So in the end it all seems to come down to a misundertanding - our non-racist Zwarte Piet has similarities to an American character from the past who was racist.

In Holland we do have tremendous issues with racism, by the way. But this is generally directed against muslims (Turks and Moroccans to be precise: our two largest racial minorities are overwhelmingly muslim). We even have a racist party backing our government at the moment, and the hatred against muslims is an ongoing issue that is tearing up our country. That is where our true problems lie, not in the color of a friendly children&#039;s character&#039;s face.

erik smit
flickr.com/eti-eti]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Okay, here&#8217;s a few thoughts from Holland: </p>
<p>Lulu Helder&#8217;s claims that &#8220;He or she will speak improper Dutch with a low voice and a Surinamese accent.&#8221; are not true &#8211; unless she saw a Zwarte Piet who was actually Surinamese (they&#8217;re an important minority, mainly in Amsterdam) of course. It is Sinterklaas, not Zwarte Piet, who speaks in a low voice.</p>
<p>What hasn&#8217;t been mentioned yet is that of the two characters, Sinterklaas is generally strict and stern. Nothing like Santa Claus. Zwarte Piet is generally funny, friendly and approachable, and kids love him. </p>
<p>I find the &#8216;not safe for work&#8217; comment very strange, by the way. But apparently the Americans have a similar character who does have racist connotations &#8211; this would explain why Americans often think the character of Zwarte Piet is racist. So in the end it all seems to come down to a misundertanding &#8211; our non-racist Zwarte Piet has similarities to an American character from the past who was racist.</p>
<p>In Holland we do have tremendous issues with racism, by the way. But this is generally directed against muslims (Turks and Moroccans to be precise: our two largest racial minorities are overwhelmingly muslim). We even have a racist party backing our government at the moment, and the hatred against muslims is an ongoing issue that is tearing up our country. That is where our true problems lie, not in the color of a friendly children&#8217;s character&#8217;s face.</p>
<p>erik smit<br />
flickr.com/eti-eti</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Cee</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/12/24/black-pete/comment-page-1/#comment-176198</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Cee]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Dec 2009 06:37:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=6380#comment-176198</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&lt;i&gt;But, as Lynn pointed out, this racism is primairly directed at muslim people. &lt;/i&gt;

I.e., you may be racist against blacks, but not as you are racist as you are against &lt;i&gt;other&lt;/i&gt; minorities!

Okay gotcha.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>But, as Lynn pointed out, this racism is primairly directed at muslim people. </i></p>
<p>I.e., you may be racist against blacks, but not as you are racist as you are against <i>other</i> minorities!</p>
<p>Okay gotcha.</p>
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		<title>By: Cee</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/12/24/black-pete/comment-page-1/#comment-176193</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Cee]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Dec 2009 06:27:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=6380#comment-176193</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Longstanding colonization &lt;i&gt;totally&lt;/i&gt; diminishes racism, trufax.

Excuse me while I bust a gut laughing in your face.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Longstanding colonization <i>totally</i> diminishes racism, trufax.</p>
<p>Excuse me while I bust a gut laughing in your face.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Cee</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/12/24/black-pete/comment-page-1/#comment-176191</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Cee]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Dec 2009 06:25:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=6380#comment-176191</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Ah, well your anecdotal testimony as someone who has never &lt;i&gt;personally&lt;/i&gt; witnessed or experienced racism towards blacks in her life CLEARLY wins out.

In all seriousness - this just serves to demonstrate how you&#039;re sheltered and ignorant.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ah, well your anecdotal testimony as someone who has never <i>personally</i> witnessed or experienced racism towards blacks in her life CLEARLY wins out.</p>
<p>In all seriousness &#8211; this just serves to demonstrate how you&#8217;re sheltered and ignorant.</p>
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		<title>By: Sue</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/12/24/black-pete/comment-page-1/#comment-176187</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sue]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Dec 2009 06:19:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=6380#comment-176187</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Yeah, keep telling yourself that.  :-)


This reminds me of a discussion I and another African American woman had with some French people about a French expression for a ghostwriter.  It&#039;s essential the French equivalent of the &quot;N word.&quot;
The French folk kept saying, Oh, it&#039;s a compliment. This person works hard ...

... like an &quot;N word.&quot;

They could not grasp that the term was offensive.



When I saw the candy display for Black Pete, I couldn&#039;t but think, now if this were an Asian character, and I saw a row of yellow marzipan caricatured heads, what would I think?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah, keep telling yourself that.  :-)</p>
<p>This reminds me of a discussion I and another African American woman had with some French people about a French expression for a ghostwriter.  It&#8217;s essential the French equivalent of the &#8220;N word.&#8221;<br />
The French folk kept saying, Oh, it&#8217;s a compliment. This person works hard &#8230;</p>
<p>&#8230; like an &#8220;N word.&#8221;</p>
<p>They could not grasp that the term was offensive.</p>
<p>When I saw the candy display for Black Pete, I couldn&#8217;t but think, now if this were an Asian character, and I saw a row of yellow marzipan caricatured heads, what would I think?</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Sue</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/12/24/black-pete/comment-page-1/#comment-176185</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sue]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Dec 2009 06:14:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=6380#comment-176185</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I have been in Paris and I assure you that there is plenty of racism towards blacks.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have been in Paris and I assure you that there is plenty of racism towards blacks.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Sue</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/12/24/black-pete/comment-page-1/#comment-176184</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sue]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Dec 2009 06:13:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=6380#comment-176184</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I have been in Paris and I assure there is plenty of racism towards blacks.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have been in Paris and I assure there is plenty of racism towards blacks.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Sue</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/12/24/black-pete/comment-page-1/#comment-176182</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Sue]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Dec 2009 06:12:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=6380#comment-176182</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[It was extremely worth mentioning.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It was extremely worth mentioning.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Cee</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/12/24/black-pete/comment-page-1/#comment-176176</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Cee]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Dec 2009 06:02:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=6380#comment-176176</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;Black people are out of sight and out of mind, therefore this is okay!&quot;

Sure thing, Princess.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Black people are out of sight and out of mind, therefore this is okay!&#8221;</p>
<p>Sure thing, Princess.</p>
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