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	<title>Comments on: Guest Post: Measuring Abortion Beliefs</title>
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	<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/07/10/guest-post-measuring-abortion-beliefs/</link>
	<description>Sociological Images encourages people to exercise and develop their sociological imaginations with discussions of compelling visuals that span the breadth of sociological inquiry.</description>
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		<title>By: medical abortion</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/07/10/guest-post-measuring-abortion-beliefs/comment-page-1/#comment-202343</link>
		<dc:creator>medical abortion</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 26 Jan 2010 14:17:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=10604#comment-202343</guid>
		<description>Does anyone know if anyone has done silmar research in the UK comparing the three main policital parties and the views on abortion. It is not such a  hot topic in the UK but there are interest groups on both side.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Does anyone know if anyone has done silmar research in the UK comparing the three main policital parties and the views on abortion. It is not such a  hot topic in the UK but there are interest groups on both side.</p>
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		<title>By: Arnold65</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/07/10/guest-post-measuring-abortion-beliefs/comment-page-1/#comment-131150</link>
		<dc:creator>Arnold65</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 23 Oct 2009 12:02:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=10604#comment-131150</guid>
		<description>OH my gosh, great questions! ,</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OH my gosh, great questions! ,</p>
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		<title>By: SouthWind83</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/07/10/guest-post-measuring-abortion-beliefs/comment-page-1/#comment-130681</link>
		<dc:creator>SouthWind83</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Oct 2009 13:43:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=10604#comment-130681</guid>
		<description>If you are rude to me or anyone in my circle, ditto. ,</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If you are rude to me or anyone in my circle, ditto. ,</p>
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		<title>By: bork</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/07/10/guest-post-measuring-abortion-beliefs/comment-page-1/#comment-83461</link>
		<dc:creator>bork</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 15 Jul 2009 22:45:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=10604#comment-83461</guid>
		<description>Chris, you miss my point.  I agree with you that late term abortions are a rarity. 

What I&#039;m saying is that I bet that the objective rate of incidence is massively overestimated by those who have swung their identification from pro-choice to pro-life.  If you were moderately pro-choice, but then come to believe that late-term abortions are common (as the right wing has been successful in convincing people), you are more likely to change your identification to pro-life.

So basically, my hypothesis is that for those who changed identification, they were thinking of zygotes in 1996, but thinking of viable fetuses in 2009.  It&#039;s an empirical question.  

But to clarify, I&#039;m not trying to suggest that they are common, liberally administered, or anything else I think Chris is accusing me of thinking :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chris, you miss my point.  I agree with you that late term abortions are a rarity. </p>
<p>What I&#8217;m saying is that I bet that the objective rate of incidence is massively overestimated by those who have swung their identification from pro-choice to pro-life.  If you were moderately pro-choice, but then come to believe that late-term abortions are common (as the right wing has been successful in convincing people), you are more likely to change your identification to pro-life.</p>
<p>So basically, my hypothesis is that for those who changed identification, they were thinking of zygotes in 1996, but thinking of viable fetuses in 2009.  It&#8217;s an empirical question.  </p>
<p>But to clarify, I&#8217;m not trying to suggest that they are common, liberally administered, or anything else I think Chris is accusing me of thinking :)</p>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/07/10/guest-post-measuring-abortion-beliefs/comment-page-1/#comment-79468</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 20:26:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=10604#comment-79468</guid>
		<description>The analysis seems to miss a rather important variable -- many moderate Republicans have changed their self-identification to independent or Democrat.  You aren&#039;t comparing the same populations in, e.g., 2005 vs. 2009.

This has two effects: it makes the Republicans appear to be more pro-life (since the moderates tended to be more balanced) AND it makes independents and Democrats appear to be more pro-life as well (since the newly self-identified members of these groups tended to be more pro-life than the prior members).  This is a very counter-intuitive result that most people overlook and gives you an illusion of change if you only look at the subsets without considering movement between them.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The analysis seems to miss a rather important variable &#8212; many moderate Republicans have changed their self-identification to independent or Democrat.  You aren&#8217;t comparing the same populations in, e.g., 2005 vs. 2009.</p>
<p>This has two effects: it makes the Republicans appear to be more pro-life (since the moderates tended to be more balanced) AND it makes independents and Democrats appear to be more pro-life as well (since the newly self-identified members of these groups tended to be more pro-life than the prior members).  This is a very counter-intuitive result that most people overlook and gives you an illusion of change if you only look at the subsets without considering movement between them.</p>
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		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/07/10/guest-post-measuring-abortion-beliefs/comment-page-1/#comment-79452</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 20:10:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=10604#comment-79452</guid>
		<description>Late term (third trimester) abortions are extraordinarily rare, far under 2%.  Remember that until recently they were only performed by THREE doctors in the entire country, and those doctors would always apply their own professional judgement whether an abortion was warranted at that point.  They could always say &#039;no&#039; if they were uncomfortable with the situation.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Late term (third trimester) abortions are extraordinarily rare, far under 2%.  Remember that until recently they were only performed by THREE doctors in the entire country, and those doctors would always apply their own professional judgement whether an abortion was warranted at that point.  They could always say &#8216;no&#8217; if they were uncomfortable with the situation.</p>
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		<title>By: Bork</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/07/10/guest-post-measuring-abortion-beliefs/comment-page-1/#comment-79319</link>
		<dc:creator>Bork</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 18:19:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=10604#comment-79319</guid>
		<description>Interesting data!

If I were to add one variable as a covariate, I would consider adding a question asking for an estimate of the prevalence of late-term abortions.  

In objective terms, late term abortions are uncommon, accounting for perhaps 2% of total abortions.  But the pro-life movement has been successful in framing the debate around these procedures, which (as @sarahMC notes) has moved moderates to the pro-life camp.

I&#039;ll bet that you could explain a lot of the shifts in self-description (pro life vs pro choice) if you could capture people&#039;s lay beliefs about how often late-term abortion happens. 

In other words, the shift is happening not because of a fundamental shift in people&#039;s core moral beliefs -- but because they construe abortion as frequently involving viable fetuses.  (i.e., what people think abortion refers to is qualitatively different in 1996 and 2009).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Interesting data!</p>
<p>If I were to add one variable as a covariate, I would consider adding a question asking for an estimate of the prevalence of late-term abortions.  </p>
<p>In objective terms, late term abortions are uncommon, accounting for perhaps 2% of total abortions.  But the pro-life movement has been successful in framing the debate around these procedures, which (as @sarahMC notes) has moved moderates to the pro-life camp.</p>
<p>I&#8217;ll bet that you could explain a lot of the shifts in self-description (pro life vs pro choice) if you could capture people&#8217;s lay beliefs about how often late-term abortion happens. </p>
<p>In other words, the shift is happening not because of a fundamental shift in people&#8217;s core moral beliefs &#8212; but because they construe abortion as frequently involving viable fetuses.  (i.e., what people think abortion refers to is qualitatively different in 1996 and 2009).</p>
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		<title>By: david in iowa</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/07/10/guest-post-measuring-abortion-beliefs/comment-page-1/#comment-78806</link>
		<dc:creator>david in iowa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 05:20:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=10604#comment-78806</guid>
		<description>Polls are very interesting but in the end when the decision is made, polls no longer matter. 

Ellen Goodman in an article several years ago wrote these amazing words,
&quot;There  will always be 3 execptions for an abortion, rape, incest........and me&quot;.

The personal trumps the political</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Polls are very interesting but in the end when the decision is made, polls no longer matter. </p>
<p>Ellen Goodman in an article several years ago wrote these amazing words,<br />
&#8220;There  will always be 3 execptions for an abortion, rape, incest&#8230;&#8230;..and me&#8221;.</p>
<p>The personal trumps the political</p>
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		<title>By: Grizzly</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/07/10/guest-post-measuring-abortion-beliefs/comment-page-1/#comment-78191</link>
		<dc:creator>Grizzly</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Jul 2009 19:26:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=10604#comment-78191</guid>
		<description>I guess it depends on which people you are talking about.  I live in the U.S. Northeast, where, in my experience at least, pro-life is synonymous with right wing religious nut jobs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I guess it depends on which people you are talking about.  I live in the U.S. Northeast, where, in my experience at least, pro-life is synonymous with right wing religious nut jobs.</p>
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		<title>By: SarahMC</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/07/10/guest-post-measuring-abortion-beliefs/comment-page-1/#comment-78090</link>
		<dc:creator>SarahMC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Jul 2009 17:58:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=10604#comment-78090</guid>
		<description>The pro-life/pro-choice numbers are meaningless because the anti-abortion movement has been pretty successful in their war on language.  People think &quot;pro-life&quot; is kind and good whilst &quot;pro-choice&quot; is forcing pregnant women to kill babies.  I&#039;ve spoken to so many people who support legal abortion but call themselves &quot;pro-life&quot; because they don&#039;t think *they* could get an abortion, or they oppose third-trimester abortions performed on a whim (which doesn&#039;t even legally happen).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The pro-life/pro-choice numbers are meaningless because the anti-abortion movement has been pretty successful in their war on language.  People think &#8220;pro-life&#8221; is kind and good whilst &#8220;pro-choice&#8221; is forcing pregnant women to kill babies.  I&#8217;ve spoken to so many people who support legal abortion but call themselves &#8220;pro-life&#8221; because they don&#8217;t think *they* could get an abortion, or they oppose third-trimester abortions performed on a whim (which doesn&#8217;t even legally happen).</p>
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		<title>By: Grizzly</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/07/10/guest-post-measuring-abortion-beliefs/comment-page-1/#comment-78026</link>
		<dc:creator>Grizzly</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Jul 2009 16:48:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=10604#comment-78026</guid>
		<description>&quot;Anti abortion rights&quot; has a negative connotation that I expect pro-life advocates wouldn&#039;t appreciate.  The description would paint them as opposed to individual rights.  I expect the term &quot;Pro fetus rights&quot; would be more acceptable.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;Anti abortion rights&#8221; has a negative connotation that I expect pro-life advocates wouldn&#8217;t appreciate.  The description would paint them as opposed to individual rights.  I expect the term &#8220;Pro fetus rights&#8221; would be more acceptable.</p>
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		<title>By: lisa</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/07/10/guest-post-measuring-abortion-beliefs/comment-page-1/#comment-78023</link>
		<dc:creator>lisa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Jul 2009 16:45:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=10604#comment-78023</guid>
		<description>Hi Liz,

Thanks for the heads up.  I fixed the stats and sent a note to Sally about the possible typo.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Liz,</p>
<p>Thanks for the heads up.  I fixed the stats and sent a note to Sally about the possible typo.</p>
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		<title>By: RMJ</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/07/10/guest-post-measuring-abortion-beliefs/comment-page-1/#comment-78006</link>
		<dc:creator>RMJ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Jul 2009 16:19:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=10604#comment-78006</guid>
		<description>Joshua, &lt;a href=&quot;http://deeplyproblematic.blogspot.com/2009/07/i-am-pro-abortion-not-pro-choice.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;I&#039;m with you.&lt;/a&gt;

I really enjoyed seeing such a rigorously cited and quantitatively analyzed piece in my Google Reader. It&#039;s a nice break!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Joshua, <a href="http://deeplyproblematic.blogspot.com/2009/07/i-am-pro-abortion-not-pro-choice.html" rel="nofollow">I&#8217;m with you.</a></p>
<p>I really enjoyed seeing such a rigorously cited and quantitatively analyzed piece in my Google Reader. It&#8217;s a nice break!</p>
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		<title>By: Joshua</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/07/10/guest-post-measuring-abortion-beliefs/comment-page-1/#comment-78004</link>
		<dc:creator>Joshua</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Jul 2009 16:16:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=10604#comment-78004</guid>
		<description>... continuing my previous post: why don&#039;t people just call it what it is and just say, &quot;Pro abortion rights&quot; vs. &quot;anti abortion rights&quot;?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8230; continuing my previous post: why don&#8217;t people just call it what it is and just say, &#8220;Pro abortion rights&#8221; vs. &#8220;anti abortion rights&#8221;?</p>
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		<title>By: Joshua</title>
		<link>http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/2009/07/10/guest-post-measuring-abortion-beliefs/comment-page-1/#comment-78003</link>
		<dc:creator>Joshua</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 10 Jul 2009 16:15:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://thesocietypages.org/socimages/?p=10604#comment-78003</guid>
		<description>I realize this blog isn&#039;t about the abortion issue specifically, but the terms &quot;pro choice / pro life&quot; are so distasteful to me. It&#039;s a classic example of allowing the opposition to frame the issue by choosing the terminology. Choice is not the opposite of life. Choice vs. Life are not the two sides of this issue. It&#039;s either choice vs. the lack thereof or life vs. death, depending on how you look at it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I realize this blog isn&#8217;t about the abortion issue specifically, but the terms &#8220;pro choice / pro life&#8221; are so distasteful to me. It&#8217;s a classic example of allowing the opposition to frame the issue by choosing the terminology. Choice is not the opposite of life. Choice vs. Life are not the two sides of this issue. It&#8217;s either choice vs. the lack thereof or life vs. death, depending on how you look at it.</p>
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